Author Topic: Speaker size: 10" vs 15" (Read 897 times)

markhvn · « **Reply #60 on:** December 05, 2005, 09:55:50 AM »

Am using 1 4x10 cab, and 2 1x15 Ported custom cab. The 15 are JBL 2226G's, which are 4 ohm 4 vc drivers. These are rated @ 600w AES continuous. A QSC amp drives each 15; one amp per speaker @ 4ohms. That gets the most power at resonable distortion. The cabinet resonance freq and the 15 is 40hZ. So, a low E sounds complete. The F-1X variable crossover makes all this work beautifully. I agree that 10's are better for the +150hZ, however, a Modern 15 with lighter magnet structure. I beleive that for a low B note, you really need to consider an 18 and a cabinet with a resonant freq of around 32hZ.

kmh364 · « **Reply #61 on:** December 05, 2005, 10:50:58 AM »

Good ingredients do not a great cake make (?), LOL! It's all about the execution (i.e., the sound), not the specs.

I'll have to agree with our Scottish Alembic contingent: I too own two of those Eden D-210XST's and they are the bee's knees! I would never have believed it having coming from the 15 or nothing '70's era of bass amp cabs. After hearing an Alembic demo at a local Dealer through the older Eden D-210-XLT cabs, and then getting a unanimous recommendation from Beaver and his Mgr. Gard over at Bass Central, I just had to get 'em! Two of the D-210XST's are actually superior to Eden's own D-410XST, itself superior to the industry stalwart D-410XLT cab. I would never have thought that a small handful of 10's could go that low.

bigredbass · « **Reply #62 on:** December 05, 2005, 12:01:05 PM »

I guess I'm in on this from both sides of the street:

I went around town and tried all the usual suspects in a 210 combo. I need a new rig, and I just can't justify a BIG rig, plus at 50 I lack the grunt to shove an SVT/810 in and out of venues anymore (geez I hate doddering of into middle age . . .)

Super RedHead: I really wanted to like this, but it just sounded cold and weak.

Mesa Venture: I expected this to really hit me, but it was just not there, either.

Fender Bassman 400: Nice compressor, lot of amp for a grand, Eminence speakers, but just not my cup of tea. Style points though that Fender engineered a single 15 bin with a matching footprint specifically for this amp.

Eden Metro: I felt like the Three Bears, it was just right. On its own, it would have certainly handled a four string, but it's asking a lot for a Twin Reverb sized cabinet to truly anchor those low Cs and Ds. As luck would have it, it happened to be sitting atop an Eden single 15, and then with that attached, it was perfect. Not boomy or rumbling, just complete. It went from sounding like a baby grand to a 9 foot concert.

I just can't completely get away from 15s I suppose.

J o e y

markhvn · « **Reply #63 on:** December 05, 2005, 12:54:03 PM »

I fully agree with you knm364; it is the sound that matters, not the spec's. I threw that out there after lots of research, and sometimes it is interesting for comparision purposes. I should honestly listen the Eden D-210-XLT. I have had some Eden users tell me that the sound was cleaner and the could feel the than what the Eden setup they were using. Could be they were not using D-210-XLT; but since they sounded that good I would check them out, especially if the weight is comparable to what I use.
Mark

David Houck · « **Reply #64 on:** December 05, 2005, 12:58:34 PM »

Mark; note that Kevin was referring to the XST's rather than the XLT's.

jacko · « **Reply #65 on:** December 06, 2005, 01:10:10 AM »

Well, after all the talk of eden and Markbass, I ended up going for EBS. I now have 4x10 and 2x12 Neodymium cabinets and I have to say I'm getting the best sound I've had for years. the 410 is very punchy and could probably give me all the bottom end I need but adding the 212 has rounded it out a bit and lessened the harshness. On top of the tone, it's very loud - I now have two very frightened guitarists ;-) Together, the cabinets wheigh less than my old Trace elliot 410 combo so my back is thanking me aswell.

Graeme

kmh364 · « **Reply #66 on:** December 06, 2005, 05:04:01 AM »

Even though I'm only 42, a nagging old knee injury, chronic lower back pain and carpal tunnel/cubital syndrome in both hands precluded a heavy rig. Thanks to the great advice I got at Bass Central, I've got what I feel to be the ultimate portable bass rig. I can carry each D210XST all by myself without getting hurt, and the Eden WT550 head fits nicely in Eden's padded shoulder bag. All that stuff fits nicely in the back seat area of my Dodge Ram, and with the fold-flat floor, my seats and interior don't get munged-up and I don't have to haul it in and out of the pick-up bed. Of course, portability wouldn't mean squat if it didn't sound good and it does sound very good.

BTW, in order to keep the cabs nice, I got super-nice padded cordura covers custom-made for them (factory covers were N/A, at least ca. Jan '04). They were dirt cheap and made to my measurements by Larry LeCover (lecover.com). Kudo's to Gard over at Bass Central for turning me on to LeCover...they were the OEM cover manufacturer for Eden in the pre-U.S. Music days. They fit perfect, protect the stuff, and weigh nothing.

kmh364 · « **Reply #67 on:** December 06, 2005, 05:08:45 AM »

Sorry to sound like an Eden commercial...I'm sure there's better out there, but it didn't break the bank nor does it break my back, LOL!

keurosix · « **Reply #68 on:** January 18, 2006, 08:15:52 PM »

Hey fellows, I would like to add 2 cents that supports Chip's, Steve's and Marks's comments: (BLTN) If you hit a note below the low E, say a detuned D, or a 5 or 6 string's low B (including those detuned heavy rock players hitting a low A or C)or the bottom of the food chain, a low F# 7 string, you need a cab that is capable of reproducing the fundamental frequency. Most 10, 12 & 15 cabs can only support the fundamental of a low E around 40 Hz and drop off fast below this in db as you go lower. For the most part, 4 string basses have been nicely supported all along, but the lower extended range players have had to think hard for good sonic support. I use a BigBen SWR 18 for the low B on my Europa 6 string, and an SWR 4x10 for the highs, but when I bought the guitar at G-Guitars, I played it through an EBS 350 amp and a 3x10 Bergantino cab. It hasn't sounded better and I didn't notice a lack of support for the low B. (It sorta put a nagging discontent on my ears for my SWR rig, too) Go figure. I'm starting to think an AccuGroove El Whappo would be the best of all worlds in one cabinet - however - it is hard to find one to audition in CT.

smokin_dave · « **Reply #69 on:** January 18, 2006, 09:58:00 PM »

http://www.philjonesbass.com/Products%20page.htm
Here is an interesting concept in speaker/cabinet design.I recently read a review in BASSPLAYER mag which gave the PJ monster cab/head very high marks.They have heavy weight endorsers with Bob Babbit and Chuck Rainey but the downside is that the stuff weighs a ton and have a heafty price tag to match.But still I'm very interested in trying out the PJB briefcase.Check it out.

And after reading this thread more carefully,I see that PJB has been mentioned.If anybody has tried these things out,please post your opinions.I'm very curious to read more about views on PJB stuff.

(Message edited by smokin_dave on January 18, 2006)

kungfusheriff · « **Reply #70 on:** January 18, 2006, 10:18:03 PM »

Meh. I haven't tried PJB amps, but I'm loath to lend my reputation to anything made in China these days, be it shoes or bass amps.
Tried and tried to like small speakers, but in practice, (at least for me) they just don't cut the mustard.
My ancient 100W Walter Woods through an E-VB speaker mounted in an equally ancient Bag End PA sub, though...woo, that little sucker can pressurize my skull at close range, and it seems to throw pretty well too. If only my bandmates would let me turn it down...
EDIT--When I saw Babbitt play with the Funk Brothers last summer (an experience I highly recommend) there wasn't a PJB amp in sight.

(Message edited by kungfusheriff on January 18, 2006)

johnbob · « **Reply #71 on:** January 22, 2006, 10:57:34 AM »

Hi,
I'm playing an Eden 4x10 XST.
I must say it beats the 1818x of trace elliot I've owned.
It's more clear, warmer, has lots and lots of punch and it's LOUD!!!!
No 15 or 18 for me with this XST beast.
O yes, in front there's my Jaydee build for me by John Diggins.
I hope to own an Alembic soon...so sorry that there is no Alembic in this picture.

Kind regards John

mrbeezroom · « **Reply #72 on:** January 24, 2006, 01:53:33 AM »

AccuGroove El Whappo

haddimudd · « **Reply #73 on:** January 24, 2006, 02:11:22 AM »

John,

That's a beautiful Jaydee nevertheless!

bracheen · « **Reply #74 on:** January 24, 2006, 03:13:57 AM »

The El Whappo is definitely on my list of gear to get one day. I had been using a 2x10. It's just in my practice room as I don't play out. I was pretty happy with it. Then, my wonderful wife felt that I needed a 15 Ashdown to go with it. The 15 really rounded out the sound. It is much fuller now even at low volumes. I am now firmly in the 10 with a 15 camp.

Sam