Bass rejected from band leaders

[Mlazarus]

How often has anyone of you been in a situation where you are in a new group and the leader of the group tells you, "I don't like the sound of that bass!" This 1st experience happened to me when I was in a jazz combo of an Army band, stationed in Alabama 1993. I was playing my distillate when the group leader told me this. I thought, there must be a practical explanation of why he confronted me, but damn, he didn't have to be rude about it. If it was a genre thing--you know the Pbass is more appropriate for the type of sound we need to play these old jazz and pop standards, then I would have appreciated it. OR was he just jealous?

Just recently, I had the SAME situation with my Series 1 Bass. The leader of the trio told me the other day "I like your 'special bass' and I know you like playing it but, can you play
your other bass (Pbass) instead? I don't like the sound"   

WTF! it's one thing to tell a bass player to change their bass (if they own another one) for recordings. You know, perhaps the producer and writers are looking for a 'specific sound'. like. Take Quincy jones for example; he allowed Louis Johnson to play his 76' pbass one their 1st album. It led to hit songs, but in 76 most bass players were playing the pbass anyway. yet, in 1977 Johnson was allowed to play his --77' Alembic series 1 Omega bass-- on their 2nd album. The sound of that Alembic was the "trademark sound" for the Brother's Johnson hit song "Strawberry letter 23". Then the following year, 1978, Johnson was playing a Musicman stingray on their 3rd album. Hits again. Johnson seemed to have many freedoms to change his sound. ALL the basses had distinct sounds, yet the songs became popular. All for the 1970's R n B, Funk genre.

So, what's the possible deal with this leader I have? I'm annoyed but may comply to his request ONLY because he wrote all the original songs. It's his group after all. I was also using a small cheap amp, so maybe if I use my bigger amp, it may change his mind. Two Alembic experiences in a row. Wow!

[jazzyvee]

I have never been in a situation where any band leader or members of the band have told me to change my bass. However, when I first started playing bass in Musical Youth I was using my maple Europa bass and the drummer and keys player at the time were telling me that my bass was too twangy. So I invited them to set the tone of the bass rig to what they thought was an appropriate sound. I thought it was too muffled with no note clarity as basically they set a sharp L shape on the amp's graphic Eq cutting off virtually any of the frequencies that you need for a deep but clean articulate sound ( think Astion Familyman Barrett"). So that sound was a starting point for me with my own rig and now I have got just the sound that "I" want the bass to have on gigs which gives them the bottom end they want and me the bottom end and the alembic clarity.  Now they love that same bass and and the sound it brings to the band.
So I guess what i'm saying is see if you can find a tonality that works with their music, as we know a lot of bands are after a visual aspect as much as a sound.

[BeenDown139]

ive gone on stage with just about any neck-through model alembic bass there is.  i've been told i was too freaking loud on numerous occasions (what?  i can't hear you! i guess i'd better turn up!) but never have i had a complaint about my tone.

i strive to make my playing fit in with the music i'm performing, but my tone is my tone.  my playing style is built around that tone.  i'm pretty sure i'd be rather offended if someone asked me to change my tone/playing style to suit them.  i'm not a slapper/tapper/oompa-pa bassest.  sorry.  go hire someone else.

i used to have a 2x10 cabinet with a high-frequency horn on it that i disabled because it was too squanky for my taste.  a guit@r player once asked me why i turned the horn off and i told him "if you think i'm obnoxious now, you oughta hear me when i scrape my fingernails across roundwound strings at full blast with that thing on".  there was no further discussion of the horn.

[DrCHILL]

Can you play with your tone to see what he's looking for?  I can understand this if you need a Nashville PBass sound and you're playing a Jaco bridge pickup tone....  It's not like your Alembic can't change it's tone...

[Songdog]

I've had that happen (in my pre-Alembic days, with a Rickenbacker 4001). The singer/songwriter I was playing with had a specific sound he was stuck on, I heard other possibilities in his music. I thought the 4001 was the right bass for a few songs, but he vetoed it. Those songs just never gave me as much joy after that.

I'd expect a Series I should be able to get just about any sound the band leader wants. Dial in what you think of as a P-bass sound, show them how the controls work and invite them to tweak to taste. Take a picture of the settings (or just memorize them).

It could also be that they're "listening with their eyes" and anything that looks like a Fender P-bass would sound right....

[jazzyvee]

I have to say, i would be surprised if there is a genre of music that an alembic would not fit into. Yes for some like reggae an alembic is certainly not neccessary when you look at the basic instruments the originals were made on, but i make it work. 👍🏾🎶🎵🔉

[keith_h]

I've never had someone ask me to use a different bass but I have had them ask for a different tone. I do try to set my amp and filters to what most people expect for the style of music. For something like blues or some jazz that means I roll back the filters and treble. It isn't necessarily a sound I prefer but it usually meets expectations of whoever is in charge. As others have suggested I would see if the band leader will work with you on setting the tone he is looking for as he might not even be happy should you use your P bass.

ive gone on stage with just about any neck-through model alembic bass there is.  i've been told i was too freaking loud on numerous occasions (what?  i can't hear you! i guess i'd better turn up!) but never have i had a complaint about my tone.

I played with a drummer who was always going off on me that I was too loud. I told him it wasn't me so one day I turned my volume all the way down and when he complained I pulled him out from behind his drums and pointed to the volume control. I then suggested he get his hearing checked as what he was hearing was coming from the rhythm guitar. The lower portions of the chords in particular. I don't know if he ever got his hearing checked but he stopped complaining about my volume.

[gtrguy]

In the 70's a local producer who was used to a P Bass sound took one look at my BC Rich Mockingbird and told me to set it on the bridge pickup for a recording session. I told him it didn't sound good that way, but he insisted. It sounded like crap and I got fired on the spot. He then brought in someone with a P Bass and cranked out the low budget record. Less than a year later a successful group I was in was getting ready to do a medium budget album and our songwriter told us we would be using the same guy.  I refused to work with him. We did a fine recording without him and he missed out on making some actual money.

1) sometimes other people do have the final say. Often they do have a vision of what they actually want.
2) 'doing good business' means doing good business with people.
3) folks should always at least listen to others if they know what they are talking about
4) sometimes 'what goes around' can come back around to bite someone in the butt

On another note, My trusty American P bass Deluxe is the bass I most often record with...
Also, later that year I used my Mockingbird to record on a friend's song (Tad Suckling's 'Molokai Slide') that went on to became a #1 hit in Hawaii, so yes, it was a great sounding bass.

[Mlazarus]

Soungdog, you hit it on the nose. To memorize or take a picture of the settings. I did just that for a song this band leader wanted. But...he was still stuck on the pbass, Probably, because i started with the pbass for several weeks, then when I finally brought the Alembic, his ears had conflicts with what he was used to hearing. So now I guess he was missing that pbass sound. Understandable. It happened to me in 2012 in an Army reserve band. I was playing my 2008 Fender Jass bass with the Tech21 SansAmp stomp box with chorus and compression. Sounded out of this world! then one day I brought my 95' Ken Smith BT6G bass. We played and he stopped the band and said, "I want the Jazz bass instead". Moral of the story: when a player starts with one type of instrument that has its own tonal characteristic, you may have to stay with it, because the group may get accustomed to that sound. They will want that bass used and nothing else, unless of course you can set the tonal controls to match.

[Mlazarus]

I have a philosophy in which I believe many bass players can relate to. It's owning specific types of basses that have a distinct sound to match the tonal quality of the genre and OR era of sound from a specific time. For instance: any music from the mid 50's (rock and roll, blues to mid 60s (Motown) to mid 70s were typically and majority influenced Pbasses (with a few exceptions of certain rock bands i.e., Greatful Dead, Fleetwood mac, The Who--All Alembic sounds. So, this is why I like to have the pbass, jazz bass, alembic and Ken smith. The Smith bass (to me) covers a lot of 80's and 90's tunes. My Musicman was perfect for the late 70s to 80s R n B. as well as the Alembic. I like what JazzyVee said about "making the Alembic sound work for the genre". That's what I want to do, since I want my Series 1 to be the Workhorse bass, but I will only use my pbass (WITH flat wounds or Dirty rounds--don't change them Ha Ha) for songs of the 50s, 60s and early to mis 70's (with exceptions of rock tunes starting in 69--YES when Alembic came aboard!). So, maybe I'll cool down and give this band leader a chance. I'll bring my Alembic (which he doesn't like) and make the tonal setting with him. I'll use a bigger amp as well. If he still isn't happy, then I'll resort to the Precision bass. We'll see.

[Pete si]

Many years ago I had a epiphone ebo. The thing sounded like mud. I had a luthier friend install a humbucker in the bridge position and the thing roared after that. I agreed to do a session and I brought my newfound epiphone to it. Some guy comes charging into the studio and tells me the thing sounded like an empty fart. He hands me a hagstrom thing with a neck so bent it was unplayable. End of session. Shortly after I joined a band and they loved that thing. I was playing it thru a fender showman head and one of the padded Knutson bottoms. They told me the bass really made their sound take off. To this day I wish I still had that bass. But I digress. I have been able to dial in almost any tone with my epic. I think that bandleader was a bit envious of the alembic.

[jazzyvee]

If what i read all the time on talkbass "the sound is in the fingers" was true, the scenario posted by the OP, wouldn't happen. 🤣😂🎵🎶👍🏾

[Mlazarus]

Pete si, Ha Ha maybe you are right. The band leader may have been jealous. Although he isn't a bass player, he would stare at it with his eyes wide open. Lol. But that may be because he is indirectly saying "Where is the pbass?" I don't know. Damn, I can't have fun with my Series 1!

[gtrguy]

Nah, the sound is in your heart and soul!

[gtrguy]

And if that don't work, get an Ampeg SVT and blow their butts off!!!