Too funny. I like playing jazz as well as almost all other types of music and I worked at it in particular back in the 70's when keyboardist Jeff Lorber taught at the community college I was attending. I recently saw a Craigslist ad looking for some jazz musicians to get together and play and responded that I was interested, but I also mentioned that I did not like 'jazz snobs'. This is some of what I got back in a reply:
"Most jazz musicians that I know dedicate themselves to a lifetime of rigorous training. It follows, a sizable number of we academic types may, on occasion, fall a little short on respect for the sort of musician who either builds a career out of three chords or who otherwise does little more with jazz than poke at it a little from a critical distance.
Jazz isn’t limited to entertainment, Dave. Many consider jazz a form of spiritual discipline. John Coltrane might tell you that Jazz is philosophy. So, I expect Coltrane was one of those annoying snobs you’re talking about.
I hope this helps you understand why jazz musicians make you feel a bit insecure."
I felt like responding with something pretty rude, but since I know many world class jazz musicians who don't act like him I just let it go...
I realize I'm relatively new here, and acknowledge that compared to most here I'm probably a terrible bass player; my primary instrument is piano, and I've made most of my performing professional living as a jazz and classical pianist although my degrees and schooling are as a violinist. My jazz piano "heroes" are many, but Bill Evans is and always has been pretty much at the top of that list.
As such, and as a person who's made a living playing whatever genre was required to pay the bills at various times in my life, I've found joy in playing pretty much any style as long as the players are good players (meaning they listen to what's going on around them, they have a good sense of time, and play with the "whole" being much more important than "self) and good people to be with. The rule of thumb is...for it to be a "good gig," you have to have at least two of the following three things... great players, great people, or great pay. You can live with one being missing. Two being missing, and the night is a drag.
Having said that, and not to take you to task for your post, gtrguy, but opening with "I do not like jazz snobs" pretty much invites the reply you got. I am an admitted jazz (and "legit") music "snob," I guess...there simply ARE skills, ears, and knowledge necessary to play those two styles that are not requirements for playing the vast majority of "popular" music. Chord extensions well beyond the seventh or ninth, chord progressions and substitutions far beyond I/VI/ii/V, intricate chromaticisms, constantly varying articulations, timbres, shadings, and dynamics, etc. NOT to say that musicality and musicianship aren't present in good players of every genre... they DEFINITELY are, and I have great respect and admiration for many artists in many styles. To me, however, players like Bill Evans, Scott LaFaro, Marc Johnson, ... a huge list could be made, but I'll stop there just to save space, without even getting to horn players or other great pianists like Wynton Kelly, Hank Jones, Herbie Hancock, Chick Corea, Tommy Flanagan, ... ooops... I didn't stop...
... are the ones that bring me to my knees with awe. Do I admire Vic Wooten? OF COURSE... the guy's incredible. Lots of other guys got me interested in learning to play fretless... Bunny Brunnel, Jaco, Laurie (last name escapes me... beautiful sound...)...
Soo... a long way of saying if someone introduced themselves to me and the first thing they said was they didn't like jazz snobs, I might respond with some of the same statements, I guess, trying to explain why I hold jazz with more esteem personally. The bit about jazz musicians making you feel "insecure" was childing and stupid, granted. FWIW, Coltrane was an INCREDIBLY knowledgeable about music theory... he wasn't JUST "playing what he heard" and enjoying wiggling his fingers. That is true of almost all great jazz players, although there are a few notable exceptions. Bill Evans was at least as knowledgeable, and incredibly articulate about music.
Holding a personally loved style above all others does not denigrate other styles, and should not be seen as any kind of offense or snobbery. We all have styles and genres that speak to us personally for whatever reasons. Personally, I can not STAND loud, aggressive distorted music anymore. There was a time when I was enthralled with McLaughlin's Mahavishnu Orchestra, but I can't stand that sound anymore. That doesn't mean I don't appreciate the tremendous artistic and skill levels required to create and perform that music... just that it ain't my thing any more.
Maybe I'm not a snob, maybe I am. i don't know. If someone's interested in playing jazz with me and/or learning more about the art form, wonderful. If someone approaches me with the attitude that they'll play jazz with me only if I acknowledged that it takes just as much skill and knowledge to play in a classic rock weekend warrior band, (not that that's exactly what you said, but perhaps they interpreted it that way?), then I may be a bit put off, too, because you'd be wrong.
No offense intended. Just speaking up for us respectful, appreciative jazz snobs...
Cheers...
Barry
Edit/ P.S... and, fwiw, that video a couple posts up was HILARIOUS!!! Great stuff. A youtube search for "I Can't Play Piano" and then "Miles Davis Shreds" and "Santana Shreds" will turn up some great bits, too... some more subtle than others...
