Author Topic: Boogieman Version of the DS-5  (Read 965 times)

hydrargyrum

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Boogieman Version of the DS-5
« Reply #15 on: June 06, 2013, 08:47:15 PM »
If you are taking AC line power potential of voltages of 110/220 volts and making them conducive to Alembic Series I/II 5 pin requirements if the +/- DC voltage is to high then you will have a reason to be SOMEWHAT EMOTIONAL !! LOL!!!.
 
I'm sorry but please explain why this can't be checked with a multimeter.  I'm not trying to be difficult, and I would truly appreciate a good explanation since you seem educated on the topic.  Can't any number of different circuits be used to produce the same result (albeit some more efficiently than others)?  Are the variations in the boogieman circuit so radical that even just looking at them is enough evidence to rule out their efficacy?

sonicus

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Boogieman Version of the DS-5
« Reply #16 on: June 06, 2013, 08:49:33 PM »
We have discussed the DS-5  here before many times , there is a schematic in this link (and some humor) _____ ; http://club.alembic.com/Images/395/60881.html?1246843699
 
Here is the PIN OUT for the ALEMBIC 5 pin  
pin 1 ground  
pin 2 neck pickup  
pin 3 bridge pickup  
pin 4 +V  
pin 5 -V

hydrargyrum

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Boogieman Version of the DS-5
« Reply #17 on: June 06, 2013, 09:02:25 PM »
Okay, so I read the thread, and I'm not feeling like I've really resolved my question regarding why the + and - voltage can't be checked with a multimeter.  In all likelihood that could be because I'm missing some fundamental principle of elctronics.  All the same.  I'm not really advocating or condemning this guy so much as I'm interested in the circuitry from an academic perspective.  Unfortunately I don't own a series instrument to use this sort of device on anyway.  But I'd like to.

sonicus

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Boogieman Version of the DS-5
« Reply #18 on: June 06, 2013, 09:21:07 PM »
The voltages and PIN out CAN  be checked by a multimeter ! Yes ! But not noise and ripple .  I like to check that when I do a repair or service on my own .   I was not disagreeing ___  
 
I personally repaired the power supply section an old Alembic IN-2 input module by replacing an aged and malfunctioning encapsulated  +/- 15 Volt DC unit with another one from Acopian . And that worked and I did so with the guidance from Alembic for the acceptable specifications. I did it for my own use and not for profit or with intention to  copy it and sell it or mass produce it . It is now restored in my rack .
 
       As far as the Boogieman circuit working ? I did not say that it will not . What I am saying is that it would be nice to know the variable parameters and see a schematic . I see differences just from the pictures . I have aligned many electronic circuits that use trim pots in pro audio gear and I know that things can get out of alignment in a NON fixed circuit;    Vibration,   being kicked around ...  etc . ... ...      
Old pro tape recording equipment like my AMPEX , MCI ,and STUDER machines all have trimpots . My DOLBY 361 and 363 with both A & SR cards need trimpot adjustments from time to time.    
 
   I just want to protect our ALEMBIC SERIES I/II Babies __ We love them _____

edwin

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Boogieman Version of the DS-5
« Reply #19 on: June 06, 2013, 09:31:57 PM »
The voltages can be checked with a multimeter. The guy uses WIMA caps, so he's not cheaping out on components. He's not likely to miswire it as his ebay feedback would guarantee no future sales. The thing that would keep me from getting one would be a moral decision (and the fact that I have both a blue box and a rack mount already and I can make my own). Even if the voltage does prove to be outside the desired range, given that there are trimpots, it does seem like that problem could be easily rectified (pun intended).
 
The only reason that it couldn't be checked by a multimeter is if the circuit were so badly implemented that the load of the bass electronics would result in an unacceptable voltage drop. Given the amount of effort that has gone into the design and construction of the box, it's highly unlikely that this would be case.  You'd have to flail pretty severely or build the thing with an intention to make people sound bad to end up with that problem. The solution to this issue is easy. If you aren't comfortable with the box or don't like the moral implications, don't buy it. If you want to take a shot at it, roll the dice. It doesn't seem like a very high risk. It pretty much does come down to an emotional decision since if you are going to take the chance, it seems foolhardy not to doublecheck the voltage. If it checks out, the risk is essentially nil and you'll have a cheaper alternative. If it doesn't, you've dodged a bullet and you're only out the time and money it might take to make it right. As I stated before, I would apply similar caution to any power supply that didn't come directly from Santa Rosa, regardless of the name on box.

hammer

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Boogieman Version of the DS-5
« Reply #20 on: June 06, 2013, 10:11:54 PM »
Alembic stands behind EVERYTHING it builds - 100 %. Boogieman CLEARLY and explicitly states that it does not stand behind what it sells to the consumer - 100%.  Enough said.

flpete1uw

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Boogieman Version of the DS-5
« Reply #21 on: June 07, 2013, 03:59:30 AM »
Kevin,
    In general all power supplies have to do several things to supply the DC (Direct Current) needing device from the AC (Alternating Current) wall.
1-   Is to in fact change the voltage from AC to DC. A well made power supply will filter the 60hz (In the States) completely out and only leave a DC voltage. A decent AC Volt meter can read any residual AC component from the Power supply if you look for it.
2-   The AC wall end can vary. You would be surprised checking a wall Voltage from place to place or from time to time at the same outlet by how much. So the Power Supply has to constantly regulate the designed voltage.  
3-   Wall power is notorious for spikes and noise. Again needing to be properly filtered out. An Oscilloscope would be a good way to see this. You?d be surprised.  
4-   As mentioned there is the load factor between device and power supply that could affect the outcome.
I have no idea on this particular unit so I can?t comment on its design. However power supplies have been around a long time and their issues are well known for anyone designing and building one.  
Should you buy it? Just keep this in mind, it all starts up with the power up.
I hope this was helpful
Pete

flpete1uw

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Boogieman Version of the DS-5
« Reply #22 on: June 07, 2013, 04:18:08 AM »
Old pro tape recording equipment like my AMPEX , MCI ,and STUDER machines all have trimpots . My DOLBY 361 and 363 with both A & SR cards need trimpot adjustments from time to time.
Wolf,
I haven't heard or read a sentence like that in a long time! Memory Lane Thanks, Pete

hydrargyrum

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Boogieman Version of the DS-5
« Reply #23 on: June 07, 2013, 04:35:11 AM »
Pete,
 
Thank you for the clarification.  I'll look into that a bit more.

edwin

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Boogieman Version of the DS-5
« Reply #24 on: June 07, 2013, 07:39:45 AM »
While I'm all in favor of well regulated and filtered power supplies, the Alembic version does not go to extraordinary lengths to create power that's absolutely perfect. It's a very simple circuit. Literally a transformer (to get the right voltages in AC), a rectifier (to turn AC to DC) and some filter caps (to smooth out ripple) and a couple of passive components in the signal path. These are all basic things that every power supply would have. If you want to be anal about these things, you would perhaps want to create a custom power supply. The fact that Alembic hasn't shows that their circuits are probably quite impervious to power supply issues.
 
So, Pete, you got a scope you use to check this all out on an official power supply? Let's at least create a baseline, if we're going to have high standards about this. Otherwise we're just speculating and pontificating. I only give myself a bit of a pass from this because I've built a couple of them and they've functioned perfectly and, as far as I know, are still doing so 15 years later. The hardest part, by far, was doing the metal work.

flpete1uw

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Boogieman Version of the DS-5
« Reply #25 on: June 07, 2013, 10:55:16 AM »
Ah no worries,
Just trying to help in what is an interesting conversation on issues we all face as far as powering our Beautiful Instruments.  I do have a scope but neither the time nor desire to do any power supply testing. I just plug in my Alembic? supply and play.  
Peace my Alembic Brothers
Over and out
Pete

sonicus

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Boogieman Version of the DS-5
« Reply #26 on: June 07, 2013, 11:38:06 AM »
Pete,   Peace to you as well brother.
 
  Some day we will have to talk about vintage pro analog gear . I am currently restoring a few  nice old Soundcraft Desks .  The external power supplies are quite beefy +/- 17 Volts DC with phantom 48 .

terryc

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Boogieman Version of the DS-5
« Reply #27 on: June 08, 2013, 11:19:36 AM »
sonicus..I agree on your post2921...unless it comes from the mothership I would not want to know!.
Can you imagine the despair of frying your electronics if you used one of the PSU's in your SI/II basses..it doesn't bear thinking about!

sonicus

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Boogieman Version of the DS-5
« Reply #28 on: June 08, 2013, 12:10:45 PM »
Terry ,Thanks .
 Indeed  ____  the thought of such preventable damage would be more then  lightly alarming for me.

edwin

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Boogieman Version of the DS-5
« Reply #29 on: June 08, 2013, 12:32:23 PM »
Why engage in such flights of fearful imagination, then? This thread is going in circles. For those of us that familiar with the circuit, upon examination it would be clear if it will work as intended. For those of us who aren't familiar with it, steer clear. It's definitely a caveat emptor situation, but it's not got so much risk as to make you sit in the corner cowering with fear about the idea of frying your electronics. That risk, once the box is checked out, is nil to practically none. That's how you prevent the damage. You measure the output. If it's within acceptable parameters, you use it. If not, you don't. Done. I don't understand what all the handwringing is about.