Author Topic: The Totally Miscellaneous non-Alembic Guitar and Bass Thread  (Read 4406 times)

edwardofhuncote

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The Totally Miscellaneous non-Alembic Guitar and Bass Thread
« on: August 19, 2015, 12:53:02 PM »
Some of us play, and work on other fine instruments... lately a few of them have come up in threads that went off into fun but unrelated tangents, so I thought we could make a permanent spot for these musings. I love to see other peoples baby pictures too.  
 
I'll go first...  
 
Here's my newest baby, taken moments after the case was opened on the day she came in to Fret Mill Music, 5/19/2014
 
 
 
and a couple days later, in better light.
 
 
 
 
 
What is it? Well, a couple years ago I had the C.F. Martin & Co. Custom Shop build me a 00-18 based on 1929-1932 specs, right down to the hide glue construction. The only exceptions to the vintage appointments are: a modern 2-way adjustable truss rod, instead of the inlaid ebony reinforcement of the time, and I had it fretted with standard tanged fretwire as opposed to the bar type fretwire in use until late 1934. To be completely technical, the shaded (sunburst) top is based on a 1933 Orchestra Model. Essentially, they built me a guitar they haven't made since 1932.
 
I sold two vintage Martins to offset the cost, and haven't regretted it yet. Well... I do miss one of them, but it belongs to a good friend and bandmate, who knows I'll strangle him if he ever sells it or defaces it in any way.  =)  
 
Comments? Who's next?

lbpesq

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The Totally Miscellaneous non-Alembic Guitar and Bass Thread
« Reply #1 on: August 19, 2015, 03:27:38 PM »
I have a parlor guitar that's about 100 years old.  The back is, I believe, quarter sawn oak.  V shaped neck like 100 year old Martins.  The maker is Eugene Howard and it was distributed by Wurlitzer.  I have found little info about this guitar or the builder.  Anyone?  
 
Bill, tgo

elwoodblue

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The Totally Miscellaneous non-Alembic Guitar and Bass Thread
« Reply #2 on: August 19, 2015, 03:28:01 PM »
Wow...it's so bizarre seeing the old shapes with a
pristine and glossy finish...and the burst...    
 
Here's one of my mystery instruments. I'll post a link to a full album with big pics for the GSI(Guitar Scene Investigation) tonight.
I'll get some good shots of the bracing etc. I think it's an old old body paired with a neck from the 40's-60's??
It sounds big and pure, with alot of punch with a little energetic playing. The neck needs a reset and the top is a little bowed.
I have the steel strings tuned way low (C) until I have a plan for it's ailments. I'll have to find some nice low tension strings  
to keep things right.  
 
 Here's some teaser shots. Does anything look familiar ?
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

edwardofhuncote

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The Totally Miscellaneous non-Alembic Guitar and Bass Thread
« Reply #3 on: August 19, 2015, 03:54:12 PM »
That body is reminiscent of Chicago-made Regal & Washburn guitars, but the neck is a puzzle. Most if the Regal/Washburn ones I've seen were braced laterally and had a lot of wood marquetry, but that looks like tortoise celluloid binding, which should help date it. I'd guess this side of 1930.

elwoodblue

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The Totally Miscellaneous non-Alembic Guitar and Bass Thread
« Reply #4 on: August 19, 2015, 09:31:24 PM »
This one has X bracing. There's the end of a truss rod hiding in there. I've got the inspection mirror out and am going to try to get some inside pics.
Thanks for the input!

edwardofhuncote

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The Totally Miscellaneous non-Alembic Guitar and Bass Thread
« Reply #5 on: August 20, 2015, 06:02:21 AM »
Not much help Bill, but here's a link to a UMGF thread on Eugene Howard... I've heard of them and read a little, but never seen one IRL.
 
http://theunofficialmartinguitarforum.yuku.com/topic/82475

ed_zeppelin

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The Totally Miscellaneous non-Alembic Guitar and Bass Thread
« Reply #6 on: August 20, 2015, 02:13:33 PM »
The side shot seems to show more of a deviation from parallel at the 14th fret than the bridge, which indicates some loosening in the neck joint. A tiny crack at the heel cap translates into a major bow topside.
 
Usually if the belly at the bridge is the bigger problem, there's some corresponding rotation of the bridge (a dip in front and belly behind, which is what X-bracing was invented to combat)
 
http://tinyurl.com/o4bfuef
 
One thing to consider is that it's the height of Summer, when acoustic guitars go wonky anyway, especially if you live someplace humid. My mentor sometimes told customers; if the action is still too high at Christmas, then you have a problem.
 
I've seen repairmen drill a small hole straight through the *heel and neck block, and bolt them together with a large washer and nut against the neck block. They had first cut out a plug slightly larger than the bolt head to countersink it into the heel. Once they trimmed the plug and glued it back in place on top of the bolt head, you simply couldn't tell it was there.
 
It took him about twenty minutes, versus a couple hours for a traditional fire up the teapot neck reset, which requires pulling the 14th fret, drilling a couple of small holes in the fret slot and injecting steam (or solvents, depending on the glue) into the dovetail joint to loosen the glue.  
 
Then you have to saw through the fingerboard at the 14th fret so you can gently tap the heel cap with a soft mallet to remove the neck, clean the dovetail, reglue it and reverse the process.
 
All to close a 1/16 gap at the heel cap.
 
If you just don't feel like messing with all that right now, you can make it easier to play by tuning down a whole step and putting a capo at the second fret. (A lot of 12-string players do this, to drastically reduce the tension.) as a bonus, the position markers remain relevant.
 
I did a bunch of research on acoustic sites to find low(er) tension strings to recommend. Martin silk 'n steel are popular with collectors, but not with players. Their sound is just too much of a departure for the phosphor-bronze lovin' aficionados, I guess.
 
DR Sunbeams came highly recommended, because they use a round (as opposed to hexagonal) core, and because they make the winding a larger percentage of the mass, it increases their flexibility. (Good lord, I tried five different ways to put that, and it just gets more confusing. I hope you know what I mean.)
 
Somebody said they're a lot slinkier than others. There. I should have just said that.
 
Newtone has a new line of low-tension phosphor bronze strings specifically made for vintage guitars, called Heritage:
 
http://www.juststrings.com/newtoneacousticguitarheritage.html
 
Last but definitely not least are Rohrbacher strings, the world's first corrosion-proof titanium strings.
 
http://www.rohrtech.com/
 
Two reviewers said that not only do they stay bright FOREVER, but they seem to be much slinkier than normal. (One guy said they bend as easy as the .009s on his Tele. Your mileage may vary.)
 
Lastly, Stewart-MacDonald has an insane amount of free information on their site:
 
http://www.stewmac.com/How-To/Online_Resources/
 
(Click the first one, action + setup. See what I mean? Holy batman, Toledo! Don't tell anybody, or it'll put us repair guys out of business! Jeff Beck on setups? Lindy Fralin on pickups?)
 
Be sure to check out the DVDs and books by the Master Blaster of repair, Dan Erlewine, while you're there. It's a lot cheaper to buy a DVD and fix it yourself.
 
Can't wait to see the rest of the pics.  
 
 
 
* an old Guild D-40, with the flat heel. I suppose it would be the same with a Martin-style pointed heel, but I've only seen the procedure once.
 
(Message edited by Ed_zeppelin on August 20, 2015)

elwoodblue

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The Totally Miscellaneous non-Alembic Guitar and Bass Thread
« Reply #7 on: August 20, 2015, 07:33:24 PM »
Great advice Ed,
I'll start thinking about addressing the belly once summer settles into fall.
 I liked the Silk and Steels ok, but they did seem to lack some gusto. I might order some heritage strings,thanks.
The Thomastik Infelds I use on electrics drape(?) nicely when held from one end,I'm guessing that translates into flexibility.
 
The neck seems tight,but I hear ya about those angles magnified. If the top comes down it might be close to right.  
I noticed the nut slots are cut low,maybe too low. I can cut a new nut.
 I might even consider refretting it with something nice.  
 
 Here's a link to some inside pics:  photo album
 
Gotta run now ...thanks for your time !

edwardofhuncote

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The Totally Miscellaneous non-Alembic Guitar and Bass Thread
« Reply #8 on: August 21, 2015, 05:33:28 AM »
That is a very interesting guitar Elwood... I don't recall having ever seen one exactly like it, and that's saying something because I've been looking for a very long time!. I do agree, the neck is almost certainly a retrofit. A body that old, (I still think circa late-30's/early-40's though the unscalloped braces suggest later 1940's) shouldn't have an allen head adjustment accessed from the soundhole. And the J.G. quote inside is a pretty cool extra! My best guess is, somebody somewhere did a cool franken-guitar.  
 
I had to dig for it, but here's a picture of the similar Chicago-made Regal I had.  
 


 
 
I sold it a while back to the fella on the right... he uses it for gigs where he has to fly, and sent me this picture of it with the manager of the Texas Rangers. Story was, the band he plays with was playing the 7th inning stretch at a game, the manager saw the guitar on the big screen, and being a guitar collector, inquired about it. Best info available dates it to the late 1930's.  
 
Here it is head-to-head with a 1934 Martin D-18. It never sounded this good when I had it... not sure why. =)  
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hZPQic6HMEc

ed_zeppelin

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The Totally Miscellaneous non-Alembic Guitar and Bass Thread
« Reply #9 on: August 21, 2015, 08:45:51 AM »
I LOVE Thomastik strings, in spite of the horrible things I have to do with strangers in dank, dimly-lit places to afford them.  
 
I found a set of Thomastik Spirocore double bass strings in a dusty music store that looked like a backdrop for a musical version of Hoarders. They had obviously been on the shelf since God was a boy and were marked down to $150!
 
My wife, the Foghorn, is from Scotland. Imagine the conversation (fling your cutlery drawer against a wall for realistic sound effects) before she proved yet again what lousy taste she has in husbands, and approved. (I think it was only because she and my ancient German upright Brunhilde are both European.)
 
 
 
Words cannot describe the incredible difference in sound (the strings, not the Foghorn). That was '96. They're still on there. Gotta love stainless flatwounds.
 
So all this babbling is to say that I looked at their website and discovered that they make a new type of low-tension bronze strings called Plectrum especially for vintage guitar[ist]s:
 
http://www.thomastik-infeld.com/family-detail/Plectrum
 
...a remarkable string that prompts comments like: ?l never knew a string like this existed!? [note: that sentence doesn't appear in the German version, for some reason] The combination of lower overall tension, hybrid arrangement of flatwounds (a,d,g) with roundwound low e, and silk inlays (for precise overtone balance) produces a beautiful, almost classical tone, with the warmth of bronze and the easy playability of a fine set of jazz strings. and because of its low, evenly balanced tensions, plectrums can extend the playing life of many fine older guitar[ist]s with weak bracing or other special age conditions.
 
What the heck is a silk inlay? Anyway, I'm getting a couple of sets, one for my pristine '57 Martin 00-15M and another for my *'39 D-45
 
 
*someday (sigh), if my line of barbecue-flavored personal lubricants takes off.

edwardofhuncote

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The Totally Miscellaneous non-Alembic Guitar and Bass Thread
« Reply #10 on: August 21, 2015, 09:25:09 AM »
I can personally vouch for the TI Plectrums... I've used them exclusively on my vintage parlor guitars for years now. Full sound, low tension... love 'em. They are available in at least three gauges that I'm aware of; 11's, 12's, & 13's, but yeah, Ed Zep is 100% right, they're expensive.  
 
One of my buds who also uses them on my advice, is running a comparison on the TI Spectrum set right now... report to follow.

elwoodblue

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The Totally Miscellaneous non-Alembic Guitar and Bass Thread
« Reply #11 on: August 21, 2015, 11:06:17 AM »
Great stuff guys!! thanks
 That Regal does look real close.That will help as I scour the web for info.
 I'll order some TI plectrums, and start thinking about fashioning(buying?) some clamps for the belly.
 
 Next up...my Alvrarez GY-1 prototype. I better double up on that string order.

ed_zeppelin

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The Totally Miscellaneous non-Alembic Guitar and Bass Thread
« Reply #12 on: August 22, 2015, 02:41:25 PM »
I've got an interesting Alvarez story. I love pre1980 (or so) Yairis. Here's a plethora of catalogs and info going way back:
 
http://alvarezyairi.web.fc2.com/catalog/index.html#rare
 
Coincidentally, I had an itch way back in my plethora just last weekend.
 
If your GY-1 has a Modulus neck, wanna sell it?
 
So anyway since that's the Jerry Garcia model, you'll really get a kick out of this (if you don't, I can come over and personally deliver one).  
 
I've got a '75 Yairi DY-76 herringbone 12-string that EVERYBODY says is the best 12-string they've ever played. And it is. It's got action like a Rickenbacker 12, with a slightly skinnier neck than most 12s I've played. Booms like a cannon.
 
So I see an ad in the local want ads (this is '93 or so, pre-internet) for a 1965 Alvarez classical guitar. I thought it must be a misprint, so I call the guy. Nope, it's from the first year of Alvarez, made within months of Yairi leaving Martin to start his own company in Japan.
 
Dude says the bridge is funky, and he wants $200, period.  
 
I'm telling you this part in a little more detail than I normally would, so you can get a handle on what happened next and how it relates to this topic, in this hallowed place, and one of those rare high water marks in my life where I was able to prove that I'm a born bassist.  
 
Because I did something so damn DUMB - yet magnificent in its own weird way - that it could only happen to a bassist, and only other bassists would know what I mean.
 
I drove up and he was waiting by the door. I said; hi! And without a word, he turned and entered. I followed. We make a beeline to the guitar. He said; here it is.
 
And it is a 1965 Alvarez classical guitar. He picked it up and instead of playing it, as I expected, he hugged it tenderly. I got this at the PX in San Angelo, Texas on my way to the plane, the morning I shipped out to Vietnam.
 
Wow. Talk about intense. I looked at his face for the first time. I was shocked. A stark look I can only describe as wistfulness radiated out of him, but his words were clipped and deliberate.
 
I kept it with me wherever I went, but the heat and humidity wrecked it. He showed me the bridge, which had rotated about thirty degrees. Everything between the bridge and the sound hole is ... Well, off.  Behind the bridge is just a nice gentle arc.
 
Suddenly a woman walked in and kinda barked his name. The guy cringed like a startled turtle, trying to wedge his head between his shoulder blades. Hmm, somethin' going on there I thought.
 
He said you want it? and without even playing it or looking at it, I said sure! And dug out the dough. The woman barked again. We both cringed that time. I wanted out of there.
 
He started to put it in the case, but stopped and said; I just want to play it one last time. As a married man, I knew what that last bark meant, so I knew what a risk he was taking by being defiant. We could both feel the dragon nearby, and we both knew that particular roar meant that fire was next.
 
He launched into a finger picked melody in D, a descending progression any denizen of this hallowed site would instantly recognize or crawl back to trolling knitting forums for lulz.
 
A fat toddler waddled to the woman.
 
FRIEND OF THE DEVIL! I cheerfully blurted, delighted that we had become pals by virtue of our common musical bond. I beamed. (For decades, that's the part I remembered the most: what I must have looked like to them, standing there with a doofus grin, my lone comment seeming to have issued straight from the pits of hell.)
 
He instantly stopped and glared at me with pure fear and hatred. His jaw dropped. He looked at the dragon. Naturally, I looked at the dragon. There was a stout, furious woman glaring at me with the same enthusiasm a vampire has for *garlic bread.  
 
I did the startled turtle thing, and turned from the laser-like beam of some kind of off-the-rails CRAZY. I looked around me for the first time. There were crucifixes everywhere. Bibles everywhere. Huge, expensive family portraits. Bible verses carefully painted on cards on a tripod by the fridge. It was like I had come to right in the middle of a 700 Club demographic.
 
I might as well have walked into their home and announced in a clear, cheerful voice; LETS SACRIFICE THE BABY!
 
I left.
 
I think of that every time I play that guitar. And let me tell you, it's wonderful. It's a shame I didn't get the chance to tell that story to Jerry. He'd have loved it. It had everything; an old Alvarez, Vietnam, bad choices of women... And an absolutely blessed guitar.
 
The rotation put the strings in precisely the right position to give it superb action. Dead flat on a dead flat fingerboard - a miracle in itself, knowing the hell this thing's been through - and a gentle dip on the inside edge of the soundhole to slope upward into the leading edge of that wacky, wonky bridge to give it just a little fight. Just perfect action. And the sound, holy cow.  
 
I looked inside it with a mirror once, and you can clearly see where Mr. Yairi started the fan bracing out as seven ribs, then changed it to five. The center rib (obviously made from some kind of Japanese willow, judging by how eagerly it bent under the bridge's trip around its axis) stayed where it was and he must have pried the outer three up (!) and eliminated two, splitting the difference in spacing among the remainder. I'm serious.
 
Because of that, I think it could very well be one of Mr. Yairi's first guitars. How could he have known it would go to Vietnam, by way of Texas, and wind up in Massachusetts in the hands of a babbling lunatic?
 
Pictures to follow, if I can talk somebody into resizing the pics for me (I'm on an iPad since lopping my big toe off, and iPad don't do that.)
 
I set out runnin' but I take my time...
 
 
 
 
* when the stakes are too high
 
(Message edited by Ed_zeppelin on August 22, 2015)

bigredbass

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The Totally Miscellaneous non-Alembic Guitar and Bass Thread
« Reply #13 on: August 22, 2015, 03:29:46 PM »
EdZ, you'll have to help me with some of the model numbers.  In the mid-eighties, I worked in a music store in Florida that did business with St. Louis Music.
 
Obviously, prior to my employment, evidently the store manager had gone to NAMM and must have had many, many drinks with the rep, as we had the entire A-Y collection from that catalog they published in those days.  To die for classicals, the 'lute-back' guitar that seemed like a wooden Ovation, a D45 lookalike, even the double-neck 6/12 acoustic.  We had a matching guitar of every page in that catalog !
 
He was embarrassed to the point they were all carefully stashed, as new.  I explained we should put them out, and he reluctantly agreed.  I sold the doubleneck later that day to a kid that had seen the Alex Lifeson ad.  
 
It was an amazing sight to see them all in a row,  we advertised it as a 'catalog sale'.
 
For me, back then Alvarez-Yairis were the most overlooked great guitars you could buy.  SLM under the Kornblums was a stand-up bunch, sorely missed these days.
 
Joey

ed_zeppelin

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The Totally Miscellaneous non-Alembic Guitar and Bass Thread
« Reply #14 on: August 22, 2015, 07:54:02 PM »
Ah, grasshopper. The answers you seek are already yours. Click the link in my post:
 
http://alvarezyairi.web.fc2.com/catalog/index.html#pacific  
 
...and scroll up. There's every Alvarez Yairi catalog and price list one could possibly want. Second from the top: St. Louis Music Supply Co. Alvarez by K.Yairi USA Catalog.
 
Click thusly and butterflies will waft you heavenward, for within we find every catalog, price list and dealer info from the 70s on up to 2010 or so. Canada, too. And Japan!  
 
You will find the fabled DY-98 Lute Back,  
 
http://alvarezyairi.web.fc2.com/rare_models/dy92/index.html
 
the double-neck DY-87 (Rush rocks, man),  
 
http://alvarezyairi.web.fc2.com/catalog/index.html#pacific    
 
even the oddball customs like the 9-string DY-58:
 
http://alvarezyairi.web.fc2.com/cat1981/p27.html
 
There is much to learn. When you can take the capo from my hand, it will be time to go.