Author Topic: Upgrade to East meets West? (Read 756 times)

goatfoot · « **on:** March 28, 2005, 07:41:18 AM »

Hi,

I have a '98 custom Rogue with Orion electronics (Vol/Pan/Bass/Treb). I was wondering if it would be possible to add a filter & a Q switch to make it equivalent to the EmW package.

Mica/Val can you comment and provide an estimate for the upgrade?

Thanks,
Kevin

kmh364 · « **Reply #1 on:** April 03, 2005, 09:12:02 AM »

Kevin,

FWIW, While I can't answer for Mica, I can tell you that to upgrade my Orion to EMW-spec costs $650. Bear in mind that I'm talking the old pricing structure (i.e., pre-1/5/05) and that it was done during initial construction (i.e., not a field retrofit).

Cheers,

Kevin

gare · « **Reply #2 on:** April 04, 2005, 06:36:19 AM »

Kevin
Check the archives..I saw in there that the filter was 350$. But that may be an old price.
Something else to consider is the 3 position Q switch, alittle more versatility. Doesnt seem like much more work as long as you're in there.
I've got an excel with east meets west electronics..nice setup, but I think I'm going to upgrade to the 3 position switch to get a little more flexibility.
Gary

bsee · « **Reply #3 on:** April 04, 2005, 08:41:26 AM »

Well, all the parts aren't necessarily compatible. For example, I was told that bass/treble switches could not be added to a Persuader.

I am sure that your bass has the space to hold the components, but you may have to replace more of the electronics than you might think. It may depend on whether you truly have Orion electronics or Rogue electronics with the filter/q replaced by bass/treble. The latter should support it, the former might not.

I suppose you should get a real answer soon, though, so hold on a bit longer and reality will find you.

-Bob

valvil · « **Reply #4 on:** April 07, 2005, 11:24:28 AM »

Hello Kevin,

sorry I had not seen this thread before.

It might be possible to do, it depends on the space available in the cavity of your bass.
If you can send me pictures of the cavity, that would be a great help. My e-mail is valentino@alembic.com

Valentino

goatfoot · « **Reply #5 on:** April 27, 2005, 11:59:55 AM »

Hi Val,

I sent you the email of the inside of my bass.

I definately want to add the tone filter and 3-pos-Q. I also want to replace the plastic elec and battery covers with brass.

I was looking around the Showcase section (always a dangerous past-time) and I ran across Bob's Custom Rogue (http://club.alembic.com/Images/411/16123.html?1107342100).

I was wondering if I might not also be able to do something similar but not as extensive. My idea is to add the 3-pos-Q and the tone filter. In addition, I'd like the bridge/both/neck filter selector switch and low/band/high filter switch as in Bob's bass.

It would be sort of like putting a 1/4 of a superfilter in there.

There would be no CVQ because I know the Mica has said that is a no-no in a non-Series II.

Is this possible or do I keep dreaming?

Thanks,
Kevin

(Message edited by goatfoot on April 27, 2005)

valvil · « **Reply #6 on:** April 27, 2005, 04:37:38 PM »

Hello Kevin,

I got your e-mail and your message; all we can fit in your cavity is a filter and a 'q' switch, there's no room for anything else; even for that we need to enlarge the cavity a bit.

In regards to the modification made to Bob's bass: Ron NEVER wants to do that again; it's very complicated and time consuming, and Ron has too many things to do to dedicate himself to a project like this. Also it's something that can be done to a new instrument only, because it has to be built in a specific way to be able to accomodate that set-up.

Regards

Valentino

goatfoot · « **Reply #7 on:** April 28, 2005, 05:25:48 AM »

Hi Val,

Yeah, I kind of figured that Ron wouldn't want to do that kind of mod. And after gettting your message last night, I figured it would be too expensive. Oh Well. You never know unless you ask.

I still really like the idea of being able to assign the bass/treb and the filter/q to one pup or to both. Would just that part of Bob's bass be possible?

To me there looks to be lots of room in my cavity for the filter and 3 switches. But if not, then I'll still probably be interested in adding the filter and q. I'll call you later this afternoon.

Thanks,
Kevin

goatfoot · « **Reply #8 on:** April 28, 2005, 05:45:15 AM »

Hey Kevin (kmh364) and Gary,

Can you tell me some more about your basses with the EmW package?

Kevin, is yours the original EmW (http://www.alembic.com/info/fc_emw.html)?

What woods are in your basses? Any pics?

How does the bass/treb controls interact with the filter/q? What comes first in the signal path? What range of tones can you get out of it? How do you go about dialing in your sound?

As I said, I have a '98 custom Rogue with Orion/Epic elecs (v/p/b/t). I also have a BB with anniv elecs (vx2/fx2/qx2).

One thing I really like about the anniv elecs is the ability to change the tone on each pup. To do this I use the pickup selector to select one pup, adjust the tone to my liking, repeat with the other pup and then mix the two with the vol controls. I'm hoping to do the same with the two pup switches I mentioned earlier in this thread but it may not be possible.

The Rogue/Orion/Epic bass I mostly leave flat but if I want to adjust the tone then I have to effect both pickups. This is a more straight-forward adjustment but it is also a bit more limited than the BB. I assume the EmW is the same but with more versatility than my current elecs.

Thanks for your input.

Kevin

(Message edited by goatfoot on April 28, 2005)

(Message edited by goatfoot on April 28, 2005)

David Houck · « **Reply #9 on:** April 28, 2005, 06:24:47 AM »

Kevin's bass is here.

Gary's bass is here.

gare · « **Reply #10 on:** April 28, 2005, 07:18:42 AM »

Hi Kevin
The active treble and bass and filter are additive. My Excel has 2 Fatboys and a mahogany body. The tones range from a nice full/round bass sound to an Entwhisle top end type of sound.
I've found that setting the filter at a real low frequency range and cranking up the bass control that it's very easy to overdrive the amp.
What I've come to do is set the amp flat, get a nice sound from the filter, then tweak the amp some. I then use the treble and bass controls to tweak the sound as needed when playing. Then you've got the Q control to throw in there to taste. I also tend to pan the pickups more towards the bridge pickup,which helps the note definition.
I've found making small adjustments with the bass control to work best,the treble control can be set higher since I haven't experienced any problems overdriving the amp. Although I have been thinking about upgrading to the 3 position Q switch,the 9 db (think thats right) boost is sometimes too much to my ear,a lower boost might do 'er.
Last week I put on a set of DR Sunbeams,so I'm back to the process of tone adjustments for them.
Hope that helps some.

Gary

kmh364 · « **Reply #11 on:** April 28, 2005, 08:20:07 AM »

Kevin,

Without the schematic, it'd be pretty tough to tell you the electrical order of the the tone-shaping circuits without dissecting them. What I can tell you is the tonal possibilities available boggle the mind.

The pan circuit alone is a very effective tone control. Guys like BKBASS Barry use individual P/U vols. and a master vol. for pickup selection...they are very effective tone controls in there own right (Series II elecs. also help, LOL!). In addition, every other control seems to affect every other control. In other words, you really need to be a tweek freak in order to really dig this control layout. While I really apreciate the enormous flexibility with regards to tonal possibilities, I tend to be more of a set it and forget it kind of guy. This set-up makes repeatability of settings VERY difficult. There are no knob/pot detents other than center (vol. excluded) and extreme limits of travel. Luckily, it's hard to get a BAD sound out of this thing. Having bass/treble cut AND boost (even though it functions as a master tone controls) gives you unbelievable piano-like high-end tingle as well as thunder at the same time! As far as preamp overdrive, the active circuitry makes it very easy to overdrive, especially with my Eden WT-550. I, similar to Gary, set my amp basically flat, tweek the amp sweet control and the eq to suit the room, and then shape the tone via the Alembic active stuff. Once you get the room to sound right via the amp, you can dial-in just about anything you can dream up via the controls on the bass itself. I've never seen a passive instrument (or another active system) shape tone with the frequency range that my Alembic does (excepting other Alembics, of course). I can just imagine a Series jobbie...I have all I can do to work one filter, LOL!

One word of advice: Be careful what you wish for! LOL! I wanted an extremely versatile Swiss Army Knife of all basses, and I got it. I tried to duplicate that J-bass vibe and tone(s), but in a lighter, high-end version with premo materials and a verstaile electronics package. I got much more than I bargained for!

gare · « **Reply #12 on:** April 28, 2005, 11:21:10 AM »

Kevin..
On your Orion, whats the second toggle switch..LEDs ?

Gary

kmh364 · « **Reply #13 on:** April 28, 2005, 11:48:12 AM »

Das ist Stimpt Genau, er, um, that is exactly correct, LOL!

effclef · « **Reply #14 on:** April 29, 2005, 06:08:55 AM »

Gary, I like Sunbeams a lot! I am fond of nickel strings and have also enjoyed the DR LoRiders in nickel. DRs seem great from what I have experienced. I get them from www.juststrings.com ...

EffClef