Author Topic: DS-5R Stereo - Mono (Read 1155 times)

jon_jackson · « **on:** February 21, 2010, 11:37:58 AM »

I'm new to Series basses, having just bought a 2003 NOS Series II (the 4-string fretted bass Almost Twins). My other Alembic experience is with Signature electronics. I had the bass by itself for about a week and a half before the DS-5R arrived, and everything worked as expected, using just the batteries (obviously not the LEDs) and a regular instrument cord to the amp. Both Bridge and Neck pickups worked fine, alone or both together.

When I set up the DS-5R (also NOS) using the 5-pin cord from my bass and with one instrument cable from the Bass / Mono out into my amp, only one bass pickup works at a time (depending on the setting of the DS-5R Stereo / Mono switch), but not both together. When the Stereo/Mono DS-5R switch is in the stereo position, the neck P/U is heard, but not the bridge P/U. When the DS-5R switch is on mono, only the bridge P/U is heard, not the neck P/U. Changing the P/U selector switch on the bass doesn't affect the situation, only the DS-5R Stereo / Mono switch does.

Setting up the DS-5R with both supplied patch cords (from bass and treble outs) into a two-input amp, both P/Us work when the Stereo / Mono switch is in stereo, but only the bridge P/U works when set to mono. No difference in pickup effect from using the front versus back outputs.

Is the DS-5R supposed to work this way in mono mode (ie only one pickup at a time when the 5-pin cord is used)? Seems to me that it should transmit either the neck pickup, the bridge pickup or both, depending on the bass P/U selector settings, when using mono mode, but as I noted, I'm new to Series basses.

If it is not supposed to work this way, does anyone have any ideas about what might be causing the problem? Thanks.
-Jon

mike1762 · « **Reply #1 on:** February 21, 2010, 11:48:11 AM »

Mono output on the DS-5R should give you both PUPs if your PUP selector is set for both PUPs.

jon_jackson · « **Reply #2 on:** February 21, 2010, 12:13:52 PM »

That's what I was expecting, but not the case on this one. If bass selector is on both, either neck or bridge output is heard depending upon the setting of the DS-5R Stereo / Mono switch.
-Jon

artswork99 · « **Reply #3 on:** February 21, 2010, 12:22:06 PM »

Jon,
Mike is correct, both PU's should work in the DS-5R mono setting with the bass PU selector set for both.

To the best of my knowledge when running on batteries your experience is normally not the case. When using the 1/4 bass output I believe that only one PU functions. It sounds as though the electronics may have been modified (summed) to utilze the 1/4 output of the bass for both PU's when operating on batteries. I did not believe that this modification normally affects the 5-pin I/O but in your case it sounds as though it has. Maybe others with experience in the 1/4 bass output summation will have answers to what happened in the 5-pin designation. You may be able to get the wiring diagram to assist. If you can get some close-up pictures of the cavity this also may help in the analysis.
Art

mike1762 · « **Reply #4 on:** February 21, 2010, 12:49:34 PM »

Yea, to get output from both PUPs with a mono instrument cord, the wiring has been altered (thus the NOS designation may not be Kosher). Check your 1/4 wiring first to see if there is a problem there (see: http://club.alembic.com/Images/16271/29811.html?1152754164).

jon_jackson · « **Reply #5 on:** February 21, 2010, 02:27:05 PM »

My impression from the FAQs was that this issue (stereo 1/4 jack so both pickups together not available on battery) was on pre-1988 Series instruments and on newer instruments, the 1/4 jack is factory wired in mono. However, as I said, I don't know much about these. I'll look at the wiring to see if I can tell if any modifications are obvious.
-Jon

poor_nigel · « **Reply #6 on:** February 21, 2010, 04:33:26 PM »

As owner of the five-string Twin, I will say that the DSR-5 and cable I received are still in the box, untouched. The set I already had work as they should with the five-string. So, if there is a glitch/mod going on, I imagine it is probably in the DS-R5 or the five-pin cable, and not your bass. All pieces are under warranty, so not a big problem if one of the three actually needs fixing.

I would think you would want a spare 5-pin cable. I bought a 30 foot one from this guy:

http://www.bayoucables.com/alembic-series-cables-click-options-p-117.html

Quality job, and if you tell him you need it in a hurry, perhaps you won't have to wait in his backlog for too long. You could then see if it is a cable problem - though from your explanation, it would not make much sense.

Congratulations on picking up the other Twin. The sound should be amazing. How do you like those knobs? I have mine posted in the Showcase as a Europa, in case you want to see more current pictures of a relative of yours. Whatever else goes on, do have fun!

jon_jackson · « **Reply #7 on:** February 21, 2010, 04:51:28 PM »

Hi Thomas. My box and cable were also still in original box and packing. Everything appeared to actually be unplayed / unused. I'm hopeful it's the cable or box. I don't want to expose this one to another trip across the country, since it survived this one. My brand new Dragonwing had its neck snapped off by UPS in November, which is why I bought this one. Thanks for the cable link.

I love the Twin. Very different sound from my DW. I actually like these knobs (appear to be quilted maple shafts, mother of pearl tops with gold dots), although I also like the ones you put on the 5-string. I had to shim them a bit as some of them were loose, but everything fine now. I'll see how they do over time. I'll post some pics in Showcase when I get time.

Now, if I can just get this cable, DS-5R, P/U issue sorted out...
-Jon

JimmyJ · « **Reply #8 on:** February 21, 2010, 06:41:57 PM »

Hey Jon,

Post some pics when you can. The stereo/mono part of the circuitry isn't terribly complicated so we may be able to help you solve the mystery here. Essentially, the summing resistors used in the bass to make the 1/4 jack mono are the same as those used inside the DS-5R (though the values may be different). The only reason there is a switch on the DS-5R is because the bass output jack doubles as the mono out. (You could have a 3rd dedicated always mono out using resistors and no switch.)

Anyway, if you scroll down in this thread: http://www.alembic.com/club/messages/449/8044.html you will see what the inside of a stock DS-5R should look like (don't look at the second modified version). You can just make out the summing resistors which go from the switch to the mono out.

Does NOS in this case mean New Old Stock? I've learned something.

Jimmy J

pierreyves · « **Reply #9 on:** February 22, 2010, 01:32:31 AM »

Hi, sorry to disturb this thread, but I have a DS-5R I never used, because it's waiting for my serie II.
In front of this unit, I was thinking it was output (left, right...) but they are INPUT ? output are on the back side ? If I understand, I can plug my signatures in the mono jack in front and use my 2 F1-X with the back output ?

artswork99 · « **Reply #10 on:** February 22, 2010, 06:05:22 AM »

There are 1/4 outputs on both the front and rear of the DS-5R unit. The INPUT is only through the 5-pin connector. HERE is some basic information for the DS-5R.

pierreyves · « **Reply #11 on:** February 22, 2010, 06:26:08 AM »

thanks

jon_jackson · « **Reply #12 on:** February 22, 2010, 06:42:05 PM »

Took some pics of both DS-5R and bass but haven't figured out how to resize so can't post yet. Working on it. Pics of bass wiring are hard to interpret: It's a Europa body style and both the 1/4 and 5-pin jacks are edge mounted, so it's a very tight electronics cavity.

artswork99 · « **Reply #13 on:** February 22, 2010, 07:29:18 PM »

Jon, If you send the pictures to the email in my profile I will gladly resize and post them for you. Cheers, Art

(Message edited by artswork99 on February 22, 2010)

slawie · « **Reply #14 on:** February 22, 2010, 08:41:40 PM »

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Click on the size tab in the window select Lock aspect ratio.
Reduce the size (either scale or size)
Click on the Picture tab, click on the Compress button.
Make your adjustments then save the document.
You will be able to paste the modified picture from this document.
i.e. right click copy then paste.

slawie