Bass Effects and Amps

[mpisanek]

I hope that this does not open up a real can of worms, but I just have to ask.  
 
If I have a very expensive, great sounding instrument (like an Alembic)  What kind of effects will enhance the sound rather than change it completely?  Many musicians go out and purchase a very expensive instrument that has a beautiful tone and the first thing they do is to run it through a bog standard effects unit.  Doesn't this essentially destroy the tonal intrgrity of the instrument?
 
I have also been looking and listening to amplifiers and speakers.  When I listen I would rather hear the true tone of the Instrument not the particular trademark sound of an amplifier or speaker.  
 
I am a bit of a purist.  My home stereo which cost more than my Alembic has no bass, mid, or treble controls of any kind.  My belief is that as a listener one should expect to hear exactly what was recorded.  As a listener to an instrument, shouldn't it be exactly the same?
 
Any recommendations ideas and comments would be greatly appreciated.

[karl]

I'm with you on this one, Michael. I bought the Alembic for its tone, so I don't want to be hiding that underneath layers of effects. I just run it straight into an amp. My amp head (Hartke 3500) has onboard EQ which I tweak if necessary to suit the room (certain rooms reverberate at a certain frequency, so it's useful to find and remove that with the EQ) and compression which I use just a touch to protect the speakers (I play very percussively - I once had an SWR speaker jump out of the front of the cab at me during a particularly bruising bass solo - and it wasn't my cab . . .), but once that's all set, all other tone changes are done with the bass controls and playing technique.
 
So, a touch of EQ and a touch of compression, only because I have to - anything else just detracts from the Alembic tone. And if anyone really wants a distort-o-grind/fuzz tone from me, I use my Stingray and the cheapest effects box I can find . . .
 
K.
www.brokenangel.co.uk
www.harambeuk.com

[David Houck]

Given what you have stated above, the only effect I would suggest is reverb; and even that, for a purist, is a matter of personal taste.  I think there are a number of players here in this forum that don't use any effects at all.  And I think there are a number that just use reverb.  And I think there are those who do use effects because it's appropriate for the music they are playing.
 
Personally, I just use reverb.  The style of music I prefer to play is basically bass, guitar, drums trio instumental.  The bass is out front with a lot of melodic stuff up high on the neck.  I think the reverb adds a significant compliment to my tone in such a setting.
 
I do have a compressor/limiter in my rack; but its function is to limit spikes and protect my speakers.  I don't use it as an effect.
 
Many of us in this forum use an SF-2 to further shape our tone.  But that's a tone control, not an effect.
 
One other note about reverb.  Different rooms have widely different characteristics.  Some rooms are quite live and provide a lot of natural reverb.  Others are quite dead and provide no natural reverb.  Having a reverb unit in your rack can help even out this difference.
 
But again, it's a matter of personal taste.  For instance, if you are playing in a two guitar blues band, and primarily playing walking blues lines down low on the neck, you may find that you really don't need to add reverb, that it detracts from the natural tone you would otherwise be getting.
 
But that's just one opinion; I'm sure there are other very reasonable opinions about effects and bass.

[bsee]

The effects for me depend on what I am trying to do.  If I'm playing blues, then straight up bass plugged into a tube preamp works great.  If I am doing covers and trying to match a feel from someone else's tone, then I add some effect and amp simulation from a Pod XT.  The two things I tend to use most are envelope and octave effects.  Chorus is a popular effect, and I think I still have a TC chorus lying around from when that was the only thing I would add.  Some years ago, I would use chorus the way that Dave uses reverb.
 
Another thing to consider is to have a blendable amp where you can add in the processed signal while keeping some amount of the pure thing.  Being able to do that really helps find the right mix.
 
In any case, it's not about burying the tone of the Alembic, it's about getting the tone you're looking for.  Even with effects blended in, the dynamics and touch sensitivity of the Alembic bass comes through.  Sure, if you compress the heck out of the signal, intentionally or otherwise, then you may lose some of that advantage, so don't do it unless that's the sound you're after.  
 
-Bob

[hollis]

I'm assuming that we're not talking about tone controls.  When we're speaking of effects we're talking chorus, flangers, delays, envelopes, wah's, etc...
 
I use effects less with my Alembics than with any electric instruments I own.  I have started using reverb on the bass thanks to the opinions of some of the fine folks in this group.  Quite frankly, I just never considered it as a bass? effect, now I do.  I don?t really consider reverb as much an effect as a means of adding a sense of room depth to an otherwise flat signal.  
 
As for guitar, I spent the first 6 months with my Skylark sans added effects.  Not because I have anything against effects, but more as a means of discovery. Once I got a handle on the Skylark?s voice, I have been delighted by it?s ability to get very musical sounds out of my effects.  I guess it?s as Alembic states:  
 
When you start with clean tone, adding distortion or other effects has a more musical and predictable result. Distorting an already distorted sound is like making a copy of a copy - it's never as good as the original.
 
I whole-heatedly agree.
 
As has been stated before, it depends on what sound I?m after.  The beauty of Alembic electronics is that with them I am able to dial in the sounds that pre-Alembic had eluded me.  And for that I?m very grateful.

[ajdover]

I pretty much use effects as a condiment or side dish, as it were.  I only have four effects (a Morley Power Wah, an Ibanez Bass Chorus I've had for years, a Boss Tremelo, and a seldom used Carl Martin compressor), so they don't overpower what I'm doing in any event.
 
On my SVT, I pretty much have all the tone controls maxed out anyway, and I use the SF-2 to further shape things.  The EQ on the SVT is used to account for room anomalies, and it works well for me.  I find that the natural tone of the Alembic comes through quite nicely, as does the sound of my other basses from other manufacturers.
 
The SF-2 has a filter volume and a direct input volume (hope I got that right!).  Basically, the direct input is the unfiltered sound of the instrument, so if one is using an SF-2 (and I don't know why one wouldn't be!), you can enhance the natural sound of the bass, while still providing a filtered aspect to the sound.  It works great for me and others on the forum.
 
Alan

[wideload]

HEY DAVE!
You mean you can PLAY on the upper 15 frets? I thought they were just there to hold the nine you need at a comfortable distance!
 
Larry

[David Houck]

Larry;
It may not be legal in some venues, especially some blues and country clubs; check your local ordinances to be sure!

[beelee]

I once used quite a few stomp boxes ( flanger, phaser, chorus, delay, eq, octave etc.) with my bass, but it really killed the tone/signal from my bass to the Amp, so I switched to rackmount units ( shorter signal path) ....... bass to rack to Amp, now I just use one unit in my Amp's FX Loop, sounds much better, I'm not a big FX person but some of the stuff I play requires it, or I add it  for a solo ( chorus, octave, delay) and some times I use 3 pedals Crybaby Wa Wa 105Q, Bass Whammy, and Blue Tube,  some pro players use all rack stuff, some pedals ( Doug Wimbish) and some have both  incorporated with one of those Bradshaw like custom rack systems ( Chris Squire) Its really personal preference and what type of things you play.
I currently use a ART SGX Nitro  with 2 of my setups and a Lexicon MPX G2 in the other, the ART is very user friendly and the MPX is a little more difficult , but it can do some insane things, I also have an ART Nightbass that I put my Chapman Stick through for the preamp with some reverb.
I agree with AJ's comment about using FX like a condiment. but in the end there are so many choices.............

[basscowboy]

I just bought an F-2B preamp and a Stewart power amp for my older (25 years) bass and want to get a reverb unit that doesn't change the great sound I've got. I see this was discussed before, so sorry for the rehash. Thanks for your help.

[bigredbass]

I've sought for years to create a 'second sound' that would be a transparent mix of light-depth chorus + gated reverb + compression + Aphex expansion . . . I've yet to find the right combination of componenents that did this.  
 
One at a time, it's no problem.  But add the four together, it begins to sound like a day at the seashore, wwwaayyy too much noise.
 
The other effect colors ( distortion, etc.) don't fit what I do, though the wild side of me wishes it did.  I'm old enough to remember amps with built-in FUZZ, so I guess everything old is new again eventually.
 
J o e y

[David Houck]

Chris; I don't quite understand, are you asking for reverb recommendations?

[811952]

Last night I used the Danish Chorus preset on my bass pod, which was kind of cool for solos (a la Chris Squire on Tormato, but with more of a hack implementation).  The pod has a nice feature that you can set a crossover frequency for the effects, thus keeping the low end clear and present.  When biamping, occasionally I'll run effects on only the treble side and run separate compression schemes on the low and high end (think de-esser).
John

[mgirouard3]

I bought a rack mount line 6 a few years back and found that the tone was completly sucked out of my bass.  It did have some interesting effects and a lot of speaker and amp modeling which is useless to me.  I then traded it in for a floor BP-8.  Just as bad.  Traded that in for a few boss efects, still changing tone then finaly I bought a V-bass.  I installed the midi pickup on my fretless and when I wanted to use my Alembic I would plug into the back of the unit, bypasing the cosm feature which can only be used with the pickup.  This too was doing something detrimental to my tone.  Now I use a crybaby bass wah and an electro harmonix q tron.  The bass wah is a little noisy when being used but when off it sounds like my bass is plugged right into my amp.  The Q tron gives you the option to blend the effect with your actual signal which sounds best to me.  

[bsee]

FWIW, while the Pod XT may not be everything you're looking for, it is tonally superior to the old Pod model.