Author Topic: Help needed - bridge saddles  (Read 744 times)

bob

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Help needed - bridge saddles
« Reply #15 on: April 20, 2005, 10:38:22 PM »
nic - wow, that saved me a lot of writing, nice to have you here. Stick around, please.
 
My first reaction was that it was a pretty ugly looking slot, neither V nor U, and some nasty looking grooves and edges. No offense, Dave :-)
 
Nothing extreme about the break angle. Even if it is shot from the opposite side, the fat side isn't excessive and the G is less. Agreed. (Almost too bad, those ebony spacers are really quite nice...).
 
I'll also be curious to hear what TI has to say. I understand the concept of the uneven pressure on the windings, translating into stress on the core, but given how soft their nickel is, I probably would have expected the winding to fail. Curious.
 
As for files, it would be great to have a properly sized set of nut files, but they're pretty expensive. I have a 6 piece needle file set from a company named Gyros, that I bought at my local Orchard Supply. It includes a round needle file that I've used on both my bridge and nut. For a G string, you can only use about the last 1/2 inch of the file, but if you're very patient, careful, and do it under a magnifier it will work.
 
Your slot was apparently done for a larger gauge. That's okay, just focus on the half round that your string will sit in. I suggest filing parallel to the way the string runs up the neck, until you get a really nice clean fit as it exits the saddle. Then file the tailpiece side, following that angle, and finally smooth out the angle in between. Better to go a little wider and deeper on the tailpiece side, if in doubt. You'd like the string to be held firmly, half way around, just as it heads up the neck.
 
I might speculate that slop here could be contributing to the problem, because then the string would end up rattling around in the slot - but it's getting late for such heavy thoughts...
 
-Bob
 
(Dave - the pictures are just fine, really helpful.)

bigredbass

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Help needed - bridge saddles
« Reply #16 on: April 20, 2005, 11:40:16 PM »
While I know our favorite strings are a hard habit to break, I wouldn't do a thing until I tried some RotoSounds, or Boomers, etc., and see if THEY break too.  
 
Filing nut or bridge saddles is truly a one way trip (ya can't put the material back!), and it makes me real suspicious that you're breaking Gs AND Ds:  That two saddles wold have been cut the same way originally and have now worn the same way over time just seems like pretty long odds to me.
 
Yes, I might radius the edges of the slots, and the bridge to tailpiece angle would have to be at an unplayable height to generate a big leverage towards breaking the strings.  But I'd sure try some other strings first.
 
In my wild misspent youth, I used to break Es and As, asI was bashing the holy hell out of them with big Fender 355 triangle heavy picks.  I finally decided I'd enriched James Howe, Ltd. enough, played more lightly and I never broke another string.  This was before I learned to be my own tech and I never even looked at the bridge, never crossed my mind.
 
J o e y

basso

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Help needed - bridge saddles
« Reply #17 on: April 21, 2005, 02:28:03 AM »
I had this problem too with my S1,i bought some very small files,the type that a jeweller would use and gently rounded the leading edge of the saddles,since doing this i've had no more strings breaking,i hope this may be of some help to you,but you may need to remove the bridge as i did to do it correctly,good luck,Julian.

David Houck

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Help needed - bridge saddles
« Reply #18 on: April 21, 2005, 04:32:08 AM »
Joey; upon further review, it may be that on this bass both breaks were D's, as I was able to determine that on the Spoiler the break was on the G.  (I get easily confused ).  As to your suggestion of trying different strings to see if the problem is in the strings; respectfully, I just have no desire to put something different on my bass for three months just to see if it breaks.  I am very happy with my tone right now, and my strings are a big part of that.  I also love the feel of the TI's and the tactile response of the strings to my fingers is very important to the way I play.
 
Julian; where did you get the jeweller's files?
 
Bob; at this point I'm wondering just how expensive a properly sized set of nut files would be.

David Houck

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Help needed - bridge saddles
« Reply #19 on: April 21, 2005, 04:40:05 AM »
Stewart-MacDonald has a set of needle files here.

dadabass2001

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Help needed - bridge saddles
« Reply #20 on: April 21, 2005, 05:08:48 AM »
Dave, you are a true Moder (Hi Paul).  
Reading this thread, it appears you chimed in at the end with a supplier to your own question regarding needle files. Nice you could help yourself out (LOL).
Mike
"The Secret of Life is enjoying the passage of Time"
 - James Taylor

David Houck

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Help needed - bridge saddles
« Reply #21 on: April 21, 2005, 05:10:41 AM »
I was just getting ready to post a thank you to myself .

son_of_magni

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Help needed - bridge saddles
« Reply #22 on: April 21, 2005, 06:45:07 AM »
I haven't carefully read all the posts in the thread so please excuse me if this is redundant.  Since it is the core that is breaking I don't think any kind of defect of the saddle could be causing it.  Since it is breaking at the edge of the saddle away from the tailpiece it isn't the string angle.  And since it happens on your other basses I would look for something common to all three, and I think you know what that is.  If you play very close to the bridge and with a heavy feel, you are stressing the core by bending it back and forth much more than if you played closer to the neck.  Like bending a piece of wire backing and forth until it breaks.  You may just have to live with it...
- Karl

David Houck

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Help needed - bridge saddles
« Reply #23 on: April 21, 2005, 07:34:14 AM »
Karl; from time to time I think about a thumb rest.  They have several advantages.  But at the moment I'm not inclined to go that route.  And then of course the thing about playing at the bridge is the tone and tactile response it gives you.  So you may be right, I may just have to live with it.

lbpesq

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Help needed - bridge saddles
« Reply #24 on: April 21, 2005, 07:35:22 AM »
Nic:
 
Welcome to the club.  Quite an impressive first posting - sort of like hitting a grand slam home run in your first major league at bat! Please stick around, I'm sure your obvious knowledge will be very much appreciated around here.  Are you a luthier?  I'm across the Bay from you.  If you haven't already, let me suggest taking the short drive north on 101 for an Alembic factory visit.  Big fun!
 
Bill, the guitar one

sfnic

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Help needed - bridge saddles
« Reply #25 on: April 21, 2005, 01:38:30 PM »
Hi, Bill, and thanks for the welcome.
 
Grand slam, my butt.  Just looking at the pictures and mouthing off.  
 
Luthier, yes sort of.  I've been associated with guitarmaking for years (detailed bio in the Introductions section), but until about two years ago I had never started to put it all together.  I've done setups forever, and extensive electronics fiddling about, but have never built an entire guitar on my own.  A friend and I are starting up a small shop, and now that the tooling is in place, we'll be building some one-offs and prototypes, but that's going to be later on this summer.  I originally started lurking here to pick up some construction tips from the masters.
 
I definitely so want to do the factory tour; I'm hoping to get up there sometime in the next 2-3 weeks.
 
nic

slapbass

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Help needed - bridge saddles
« Reply #26 on: April 23, 2005, 03:20:34 PM »
Dave,
 
If you can't find a good set of needle files let me know and I will ship you a set of nut files. When your done just send them back. I know how hard it is to not have the right tool so this may help you out with the sting breakage issue.
 
Dale

David Houck

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Help needed - bridge saddles
« Reply #27 on: April 23, 2005, 06:26:34 PM »
Thanks Dale; I might get in to town tomorrow to see what I can find.  And I did come up with a couple ideas on the net.  But if nothing pans out soon, I'll let you know.

basso

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Help needed - bridge saddles
« Reply #28 on: April 25, 2005, 02:12:23 AM »
Dave you can get the files from most jeweller's supplies,i didn't have a problem here in the UK ,it did the trick for me,good luck,Julian.

dannobasso

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Help needed - bridge saddles
« Reply #29 on: April 25, 2005, 08:50:27 PM »
You can get a set of needle files at Sears Hardware folks. Home Depot, Lowes should also carry sets and individual files.  
Embrace doing things yourself as best you can.
Danno