Talking about bridge spacing

[mica]

So for about 30 years or so, we've been slotting our string nuts center-to-center and the bridge saddles edge-to-edge. This makes it hard to compare to other makers' center-to-center bridge spacing. Of course we could just go center-to-center, which is easier to do, but we like it the hard way since it really does improve playability for most players. Of course center-to-center is an option on a custom, and we do them from time to time.
What I'd like to know is what fingerboard taper you're playing,  and if you can suggest what center-to-center spacing it sort of feels like. This is purely subjective, but let's see where people wind up. These are the main ones I'm looking for:

1.75 x 2.25 Classic 4
2.00 x 2.50 Classic 5
1.50 x 2.15 Narrow 4
1.625  x 2.35 Comfort 4
1.875 x 2.93 Comfort 5
Please reply with either the name of the taper or dimensions and what you think it feels like. For instance:
Comfort 5 - 18mm
1.75 x 2.75 Custom 5-string -17mm

Thanks very much!

[pauldo]

Mica,
1984 Distillate
1.75” x 2.23” Classic 4 -17mm
It feels like home as it has been my main bass for decades - I love it!




Details below, using dial caliper.
1.752” just past nut (neck width - fingerboard has shrunk a tad)
2.234” at very end of fingerboard (just past 24th fret)

1.978” at bridge measuring from center of E to center of G strings (eyeballed withOUT removing strings)
2.085” outside of E - G strings
2.350” outside of bridge saddles

Individual string spacing center to center at bridge (eyeballed withOUT removing strings)
.685” E - A
.663” A - D
.650” D - G
Average spacing is .666” [16.92mm]


Paul

[JimmyJ]

Mica,

I think you explained this to me once but I'd forgotten about the center-to-center spacing at the nut and edge-to-edge at the bridge.  That is interesting!  Can you clarify how to measuring the taper?  Is it between the outer two string centers at the nut / bridge? 

I know my basses may have unusually tight spacing but this will be a fun thread to follow.  We're talking about a very subtle measurement here and I wonder if I could even tell the difference if I played a bass spaced one way and then picked up and played a bass spaced the other way?  Would it cause me to rush my low notes?  (I don't need any help to do that, it happens naturally  .)

Jimmy J

[mica]

The taper is the fingerboard taper. Jimmy, your basses are the classic 5 taper or close to it. Paul, yours is the classic 4 taper. This difference is indeed subtle, but small things can make a big difference.

I'm looking for basses made after 1995 since that's approximately when we changed the edge spacing.

Since you can't compare the center to center measurements between our basses and others directly, and averaging doesn't help understand how it feels, I just want to get a general impression that people have of their basses. I know what the measurements are but I want to know how it feels to play. My references are all Alembic so I'm no help (nor am I really a bass player!). I know what the measurements are, but how does the spacing compare to other basses that do use center to center spacing.

Or maybe more simply: Does your Europa 5 feel like 18mm spacing?

[keith_h]

I can't equate feel to an actual measurement but can give a comparison to other basses I play or have played. One thing for me is neck reach has an effect on which taper I prefer. A thinner neck at the nut feels more comfortable on a long scale bass and the wider one feels better with a short scale. I hope this will be helpful.

Classic 4
Comfort 4
Comfort 5

On my 4-string short scale basses I have the Classic taper. I can't say what they feel like other than they seem to work well with my shorter fingers. They remind me a little of the neck on my Hagstrom 8-string but I haven't played it as a 4-string in decades so can't make an apples to apples comparison.

On my long scale basses I prefer the Comfort taper. Both my 4-string and 5-string basses are close enough to my 1976 Fender Jazz Bass that they feel the same when playing. In fact when I purchased the Orion 5-string, my first Alembic, I was surprised how similar the feel was which helped adapting to the 5th string. Taking 4-string/5-string differences into account I compared the neck dimensions on my 5-string Orion and the JB shortly after buying the Orion and remember them being very close in their dimensions and spacing when measured center to center. I recall making a similar comment to Susan back at the time. 

[BeenDown139]

i'm not sure i did this correctly, lmk if i'm in left field.  i measured the string spacings center-to-center at the nut, the width of the nut at the neck end, strings inside edge-to-edge at the saddle and the width of the fingerboard where it terminates.  i have 4 basses:  the A-bass (03? LSB fretless 4-string shop night bass with replaced neck), the cheap bass ('98 LSB fretless essence 5-string), the ebony amazon ('81? LSB customized SII 5-string with replaced neck) and the MKD ('18 LSB mark king deluxe 5-string)  here's what i measured with my steel ruler and my calibrated eyeballs.  all measurements in millimeteres:


                                    A-Bass          Ebony Amazon    MKD        Cheap Bass
nut center-to-center       10                     10                     10                    10
Nut width                         37                     44                     47                    48
Saddle edge-to-edge      17                     16                     19                    19
End of fingerboard          56                     69                     72                    73

all of my basses are being worked into my '80s cover band rotation, so they gotta work in a show situation .  lately, i've been taking 1 fretted and 1 fretless i various combinations to shows with me.
i bought the A-bass for artsy-f@rtsy projects and because i love the sound of a high-end fretless.  i really wanted a 5-string but oh, well.   it's my only 4-string.  the neck feels really narrow and it's definitely the hardest one to finger left handed because the neck's so skinny and feels narrow.  but it's fast and sings like a airy angel.
the cheap bass (as it's affectionately known.  nothing cheap aboot this bass i'm here to tell ya)  has a really thick neck (no re-enforcing laminates?) and what feels like a freeway-wide fingerboard.  it plays just like her fretted cousins and can take a real beating from my right hand.
The MKD and Ebony Amazon are my main players.  the ebony amazon has extra neck re-enforcement so the neck feels thinner than the MKD.  the MKD has slight wider bridge spacing so my right hand loves it for popping and snapping,  the Ebony amazon is not as easy to man-handle (finger?) with my right hand but the slightly narrower string spacing makes really fast and easy fingering for my left hand.  plus it sounds like the trumpet of the apocalypse.

hope that helps.  lmk if ya need further info.

[chrisalembic]

I owned a black Europa Comfort taper 5 for a while and it was made somewhere between 2012-2014. The neck to me felt quite similar to my other non Alembic 5 string basses with 18mm spacing measured center to center. And definitely wider and more comfortable (to me) than 17mm spaced (center to center) non Alembic 5 string basses (such as Modulus or Pre Gibson Tobias).

In fact it must have been one of my favorite 5 string necks ever because it wasnt too skinny and also not that round. Instead it felt more flat and rather like a D shape instead of a C shape. I really dont like necks that are too shallow or too rounded with a vinatage fingerboard radius. And thats more so with 5 or 6 string basses. But of course its all subjective.

Thats one thing I really love about Alembics and in particular Alembics with the comfort taper: the neck shape and feel! 

[FC Bass]

The difference is a bit too subtle for me :-)
However... When I recorded the 4 Alembic comparison vid, I had to play some riffs a couple of times to ensure pick accuracy while switching between two tapers.
Two tapers in my stable: Old ('83 and '88) Classic 4 string and modern ('99, '10 and '23) Comfort 5 string.

I played the Classic 5 string taper once, pretty sure I prefer the wider Comfort spacing :-) (this one: https://www.alembicguitars.com/info/ken_bass.html)
Owned Comfort taper 4 string (2006 fretless) and prefer the Classic 4 string since I'm used to it. (started my "A" journey on it)

[mica]

Flip, can you compare the bridge spacing on your basses to  non-Alembic basses that use center to center bridge slots? Does the Comfort 4 feel kind of like 17mm spacing?

[FC Bass]

No such thing as non-Alembic basses in my life... 


It would be too miniscule for me to notice, with the " great jump"  I hardly notice it. great jump = going back and fort between Classic 4, Fender Jazz and Comfort 4


Other basses I've had (and played intensively next to the Alembics) in the past: Fender Jazz bass 5 string, Fender Jazz bass 4 string, Rickenbacker 4001 and an Aria SB B&G
Never had problems going back and forth. Also never had the Fender 5 string next to an Alembic 5 string, only used that one with the classic taper Alembic 4 strings.
Main reason for letting all those basses go was tone, playability (though always superior on Alembics) has never been an issue.
So I guess the difference is too subtle for me, or I have muscle memory presets for each bass 

[cntrabssn]

The basses I have that meet the build date requirement are:
Comfort 4
Comfort 5

They all subjectively feel like they could have 18mm bridge spacing. They feel just a bit tighter than the instruments I have with 19mm center-to-center spacing (F-Bass and MTD), but definitely wider than a bass with 17mm spacing (pre-Gibson Tobias).

[goran]

What is the difference, forgive my newbie question, but what is the difference between centre to centre vs. bridge saddles edge-to-edge... not sure what's the difference if the spacing is in mm measured?

[JimmyJ]

The difference is VERY subtle, like 1/2 a string width!  In other words, with center-to-center the actual space between a low-B and low-E string would be maybe just a couple mm(?) less than the space between the D- and G-strings.  I think Mica is asking if anybody can feel that.  I don't think I can. 

Jimmy J

[adriaan]

What is the difference, forgive my newbie question, but what is the difference between centre to centre vs. bridge saddles edge-to-edge... not sure what's the difference if the spacing is in mm measured?

Goran, not sure I'd call you a newbie? 

A bass with "18 mm spacing" has the strings in slots on the bridge saddles, and the distance between those slots is 18 mm: this is the center-to-center spacing that most basses have. If you measure the gap between the windings of the E and A strings, where your finger or plectrum goes, it is a bit smaller than the gap between the A and D strings, which is again smaller than the gap between the D and G strings.

On an Alembic, the gaps between the windings of the strings are (roughly) the same width, edge-to-edge, so the slots in the saddles of the E and A strings are further apart than the slots for the A and D strings, etc.

[mica]

This is much easier to talk about than to type about.

Let me show some numbers on the subject. Our normal bridge spacing on a Comfort taper 4 is:

• spacing between 1 and 2 = 0.660 ~16.7mm
• spacing between 2 and 3 = 0.660 ~16.7mm
• spacing between 3 and 4 = 0.660 ~16.7mm

.66 inches is close to 17mm. But this is the space between the strings.

When we talk about the center to center spacing on the same instrument, it looks like this:

• string center 1 to 2 = 0.715 ~ 18.1mm
• string center 2 to 3 = 0.733 ~ 18.6mm
• string center 3 to 4 = 0.753 ~ 19.1mm

But the feedback I get is that most people perceive this spacing to be less than 18mm.

So what I'm curious to know, is that if you just go by feel, do you have a feeling or a vibe about how you would describe the string spacing at the bridge? Older than 30 years are typically already center to center, so they should feel exactly like any other center to center spacing.
What I hope to do is to advise people that are used to playing center to center spacing, a player-based opinion on how how different way of spacing generally feels, something like "the Comfort 4 taper feels just a little under 18mm bridge spacing to many players"