you're too snappy

[BeenDown139]

<rant mode on>

i usually set my tablet up to record ourselves when we play mostly because i'm a bass narcissist and i love to watch myself play.  our band leader apparently obsesses over those videos and dissects our every performance.  so today at rehearsal a took a lotta heat from our keybroadist and drummmer because they think i pop my strings too much when i play live.  my reply was that's why i play an alembic strung with rounds through a bi-amp rig with 250 watts driving just the 2x5 cabinet so i won't get lost in the mix.  that's how i've played from day 1 with y'all.  i'll try to dial it back but if ya want a thumper that you can bury in the mix, hire someone that plays a fend3r!

ya ever had anybody tell ya yer playing's too snappy?  it's kinda like someone calling yer baby ugly. 

ok i'm done

<rant mode off>

[Quasar1]

I dont know your situation but, if they are not layin the cash on you for these gigs, I'd say, pack your gear and tell them , "look man, I don't need this" !

I had to do it once myself , this one cat told me, you might not be the right fit, that's about all I needed to hear

See ya!

[pauldo]

I HAVE been asked to roll back the bass’s high-end on a few occasions.  It was offensive at first, but reflecting back, it was about the whole song/ band and not about what I felt I should sound like.

I am a Prince fan and went back to Purple Rain and listened with headphones.   

The bass has solid bottom end (is the keyboard player also playing a bass part?).   The ‘snaps’ are accents and add extra emphasis in key parts to the song.  There are a few moments where the low end of the bass is overridden/ lost by the ‘snaps’. 

The leader is the drummer?

My .02, from the outside looking in:
You are in a band with a nice repertoire of songs. 
You guys played a gig and probably have more on the horizon. 
Locking horns with the leader of the group over some clickity clacks could go south pretty quick… is it worth it to you?

If you are having fun in this band maybe only send 200 watts to your 2x5?   


Alternatively you can start your own band or look for another. 

[jazzyvee]

I had the same thing in a reggae band I played with. So at rehearsals i kept everything low but on the gigs, I tend not to roll the filters back so far so that I get a bit more mids from my cab and monitor mix and suggest those who don't like the tone to ask the monitor guys to adjust their mix accordingly. My reason is that many of the stages, especially outdoors, tend to have large subs under the stage so it can be muddy and hard to pitch so for me adding those extra frequencies helps with hearing my pitch, especially when it's a short notice dep gig or a band where i've not played with before and having to focus more on what i'm hearing as apposed to what I know. :-)

On the other hand, when I first started gigging with my alembic i kind of got hung up on wanting the "alembic" sound to be noticeable, otherwise what's the point? In those days I did have a more open sound but as time has gone by i've become less hung up on that and just aim to get a sound that serves the song. I'm getting better at that. The audience... they just want to hear bass and just want to enjoy the music.
BeenDown139, I do like your style of playing and have watched most of your recent posts and not found the snappy moments distracting at all. They don't come across overtly brightly on my audio system but then there are a lot of electronics and processing between what leaves your bass and my ears on this side of the pond.
I will be interested in what the outcome is from this.

[cozmik_cowboy]

You are not alone.

"Sounds like shit; got a Fender?"
Terrapin Station producer Keith Olsen to Phil Lesh, in re Mission Control.

Peter

[Songdog]

Ugh! I've been through something a little like that before (in my pre-Alembic days, in fact)... the guy I was playing with was good, but his tastes in bass sound leaned towards Crosby, Stills and Nash, and mine were more Jefferson Airplane. I was kind of relieved when he moved away and I'm now playing with people who let me be me and seem satisfied with that.

Is your band leader judging your sound solely by watching the videos on yootoob? And that audio is from your tablet on stage? The stage sound captured by a tablet and processed through the tablet's AGC and devil knows what at yootoob is going to be very far removed from what the audience perceives. In particular, the very short percussive peaks of bass notes will push everything else out of the way - that's an artifact of processing, not representative of how people hear it live.

A while back I was playing a small gig (wine tasting room) with a semi-acoustic band; for a song or two our guest vocalist played piano and I handed our usual keyboard player my Alembic and listened from the audience. The sound that I had thought, from my on-stage perspective, might be a little over the top bright actually wasn't that way at all out in the room. It was just thick (in a good way) and very present without being too out front.

So your band leader (and you) can just relax over this a little, don't let it blow up a great band. Casual videos are fun, they're good for getting some idea of how the show hangs together, but really can't really tell you what the mix sounds like to the audience. Maybe get some trusted friends to report how it sounds in the room?

[BeenDown139]

so in my defense, i offer up this video from the show.  my right hand technique is on full display and yeah i pop the strings a lot even for accents and stops.  it's really almost a sub-conscious thing with me.  it's not like i'm yanking 'em off the bass or going full-on marcus miller.  also the sound from this gig recording leaves a lot to be desired - recorded on a tablet in selfie mode using a coupla lapel mics that were pointed almost directly at my amp propped behind the PA stack from stage left.  so it's pretty much all me and my 2x5.  even with my hearning loss i can hear all the fret and string noise cutting through. i'm kinda surprised you can hear the rest of the band at all.  it's not really representative of how we actually sound and i made that quite clear.  after my bass sound intervention i asked some people who were at the show about our sound and everyone thought we sounded great (we used a sound man for this gig) and the bass was well-balanced and clear (this coming from a former band-mate who was there). 

so i think moving forward we'll place the tablet in a more judicious postion, maybe tone down the bridge pickup amp a little, keep on smilin' and tell the bass haters to mind their own P's&Q's!  this band's too good to walk away from for something petty like this. 

[gearhed289]

You do have an interesting right hand technique and your own kind of tone, but I don't think any of it is detrimental to what you guys are doing. If anything, it makes the stuff a little more interesting. But, I'm a lifelong bass player, so what do I know?

[keith_h]

It might be the recording but listening on my studio setup I hear a lot of fret noise/buzz. I also notice a lot of percussive notes from what looks more like the string being hit/tapped rather than plucked. For the Tubes tune I think it is ok but is a bit much for Little Wing. Of course the only way to know for sure is to be out front where you can hear the full mix with your own ears.

It was hard to tell as I couldn't find a full on front shot but it looked to me that the bridge CVQ is at full boost and the neck close to it. Having a Series 1 I either set no boost or the 3 dB boost for the times I need to sit in the mix. The only time I use the full Q boost is for effects or solos. I generally leave my filters wide open and if I need to roll back the highs try to do it in the preamp. When I bi-amp I might also do some balancing of the high end with the amp volume.

[lbpesq]

I do hear a sort of tambourine tap that sounds like maybe a string is ticking against a fret?   It could also be a certain vibration causing something in or near the camera, or something else, to rattle.   Otherwise, I really dig your tone.  A lot of rockers, and your keys and drums may be among them, are from the "bass should be felt and not heard" school.    I'm not in that camp - the articulation of Alembic basses is why I love them.

Bill, tgo

[pauldo]

… - the articulation of Alembic basses is why I love them.

Bill, tgo

Yes.

[BeenDown139]

It was hard to tell as I couldn't find a full on front shot but it looked to me that the bridge CVQ is at full boost and the neck close to it.

so lemme preface this by saying i leave both tone knobs wide open and i vary my tone mostly by where i play with right hand (usually somewheres between the 12th fret and the bridge pickup).  i'll nudge one of the pickup volumes or the master (love that master) for whatever i need for the song and that's it.  i don't fiddle with the knobs on that bass otherwise.  there's alot of 'em.  so yes the both tones and CVQs are maxed out.  you got me to thinking i might just be boosting what i don't wanna boost,   so i zereod the CVQs and did my practice set thru my home setup.  it was subtle, but it took the edge out of the bridge pup without making it less sharp if that makes sense.  i'm thinking maybe that's hwat my bandmates find objectionable (other than the fact that i got the coolest instrument on stage) with the SII.

one of our next songs is gonna be sweet child o mine by G & R.  it's not hard to pull that grindy detuned duff tone outta that bass, especially when i crank it and lean into it a little, which will probably happen tommorow..  we'll see who gripes then.

[cozmik_cowboy]

A few points, if I may:
Noise:
I agree with Bill; I hear a tambourine very prominently - but  no string or fret noise.
Technique:
From an old C.F. Martin ad:  "Your left hand is what you know, your right hand is who you are."  Be true to your self.
Settings:
When you say you keep "tone" and CVQ wide open, am I to read that as all four knobs clear clockwise?  The filter knob set there is allowing everything from 6KHz down through, and the CVQ set there is giving 6K a 15dB bump; that might be what is irking your comrades.
Overall sound:
As a soundman I have not really said this very often, but - were I mixing you, I'd turn up the bass (and break the tambourine......)

Peter (who is a firm believer in massive low-freq air columns, will add that what you need is a 1X18 & a 2X12 - and not just to give my erstwhile colleagues employment........)

[jon_jackson]

"so yes the both tones and CVQs are maxed out.  you got me to thinking i might just be boosting what i don't wanna boost,   so i zereod the CVQs and did my practice set thru my home setup.  it was subtle, but it took the edge out of the bridge pup without making it less sharp if that makes sense."

Just my opinion from listening to the Little Wing video (great bass line!), but I think this may be the right path. I find that max CVQs (or even a 9db switch) can highlight things one doesn't always want highlighted, at least for my taste (and I hate thumpy, thud-like bass tone). Filters wide open; judicious Q use.

[keith_h]

A bit of a delay as I've been tied up (not literally). I think backing off on the boost is a good place to start. What I'm calling the percussive sound could very well be sounds coming through that you don't want coming through and what the others are hearing.