Persuader Bass

[Keith Wilson (darkbassist)]

Not too long ago I purchased a Persuader bass.  Mine has a volume control for each pickup, and teh Q-Filter/tone control.  But I recently saw another persuader that had those same three knobs, but it also had a switch on it.  I think it might have been an active/passive switch, but i'm not sure.  I was just wondering Mica, did you all used to put switches on some of the earlier, or later models (mine is a 87) or was this probably just a custom option?

[mica]

Persuaders were essentially Spoilers with our Activator electronics. Most of the Persuaders we made did not have the Q switch. There were one and two pickup versions, some with AXYs, others with P or JZ pickups.
 
It's confusing to distinguish Spoilers from Persuaders (in large part why we dropped the Persuader from our catalog years before the Spoiler). The serial number code will reveal if we considered the bass a Spoiler (S) or Persuader (P).

[Keith Wilson (darkbassist)]

What did the Persuaders list for in price new?  So are they like lower model Spoilers, or just a different style inspired by that design?  Also, on mine, the jazz pickup is considerably softer in volume than the precision pickup.  when soloing the pickups, i have to cut the jazz pickup all the way to full just to match the volume of the p-pickup when it is barley even turned up.  is this normal?  when i do have them both on at the same time, slight changes in the jazz pickup make a pretty big difference in the over all tone, but when soloing them, the jazz pickup seems to loose all of its strength.

[mica]

It's probably most accurate to describe the Persuader as a Spoiler with Activator electronics. These were always about $200 less than a Spoiler. Current replacement value is about $3300 in any standard wood.
 
I'm sorry, but we don't track original list prices. I'm sure I could dig up papers from 1987, but I don't have the information handy.  
 
About the volume difference, the bass you have probably shows it the most. The P pickup is one of our loudest pickups, and the JZ is one of the softest. Add that to the positioning with the poor skinny JZ pickup back where the string doesn't move much, and without a separate preamp for each pickup, there will always be a volume difference between the two. Currently you have one preamp and one over gain control inside the bass.
 
You could send your bass in for a modification to add a preamp for the bridge pickup. This will give you a separate gain control for each pickup so you can set the height to where you like the quality of the sound, and then adjust the gain so the pickups are of equal volume. This is all internal work, and the exterior of the bass will not be affected by the modifiactions. This will run about $350 excluding shipping charges.

[Keith Wilson (darkbassist)]

Thanks a lot for the info.  I might seriously do that.  Matter of fact, I know will.  I just don't know how long I can stand to be away from my baby.  You speak of the internal gain control.  is it possible for me to turn that up so that i get the j pickup where i want it, and then compensate by not turning the p-pickup volume control that high, or would that distort the sound?  am i making any sense?  if i can't do that, i guess i'll have no other choice but the send it end, because i love that j-pickup and i really want it to cut through more.  about how long do you think it would take for me to get it back?

[mica]

The gain controls have no effect at all on the tone. You've got the idea - make the JZ pickup work to your taste, then adjust the P so it doesn't take over. Call me up a week before you plan on sending it and I can have some of the electronics work ready when your bass arrives. Turnaround depends entirely on the workload when you send it in.
 

[Keith Wilson (darkbassist)]

How do I increase the overall gain control?  I notice a little knob thingy inside of the control cavity, but it is mounted on the tone circuit, so I assume that is for boosting the overall db of the tone control when it is turned.  Am I correct in assuming this?

[mica]

You've found it. Usually the trim pot is a small blue Bourns pot with a white screwdriver slot. Typically we set it at about 50%, so there's much room to move up or down. This adjustment will have no affect on the tone, just the gain.

[Keith Wilson (darkbassist)]

Thanks for the help.  By the way, I just saw what you posted about the recent rise in fake Alembics.  I actually got a to good to be true deal on mine.  But from my inspection, not to mention that I trust the dealer, unless he was also tricked, ?t seems 100% real.  Is it possible for you to post a pick of a persuader bass for me to compare mine to?  The only thing about it that I've never seen on one of your basses is the type of knobs on it, but that could have been changed by the owner, so that isn't a reason to think it is fake.  it seems 100% real.  the serial number is exactly how and where it should be.  The logo is in the right spot.  the electronics are the connector type kind you use (the ones that don't require soldering, just snap the connectors together) and so on.  But maybe I could use something to compare it too.  I do have on question though, and I might not be able to accurately ask it with out showing you a picture, but the jack of the instrument cord... last time i looked at it, i thought it was a closed jack (meaing that if i took the control plate off i couldn't look from the outside of the jack and see the rest of the control compartment because it was open ended on the inside.  but then one night i heard something making a rattle noise inside of the bass when i moved it, and when i took the cover off, i noticed that the jack was open.  you could look at it from one side and see straight through it (as opposed to jacks that are closed on the inside).  i was wondering if i broke the back off of it, or was it open anyway.  and if it was open, i couldn't figure out what was making the rattle noise.  it stopped after a few times of turning the bass up and around.  it sound like something moving around inside.

[mica]

I think the jack is fine, it's normally as you describe open-ended. Not sure about the source of the rattling. If there's some debris in there, you're certain to hear it again.
 
Here's a reference for the Persuader:

[Keith Wilson (darkbassist)]

the pic didn't work.  thanks for easing my mind about the jack.  i was praying that it came that way in hopes that i wasn't responsible for causing harm to my baby  

[Keith Wilson (darkbassist)]

i was looking at some pics of some other persuaders, and i noticed that in addition to the 3 knob configuration, they also had a switch.  did this come standard at some point in time, or where they special request by the owner?  what do these switches do, and how much would it approximately cost for me to get it added to mine?

[mica]

The switch is likely a Q swtich if it's a 2-position mini-toggle. It allows the 8dB boost at the cutoff frequency of the filter to be dampened. Currently, your bass is wired like there's a Q switch always in the on position.
 
The kit is $45 and requires the removal of a capacitor, and the installation of a switch and another cap. Plus you need to drill an additional hole to mount the switch. We do the whole job for $125, includes all parts and labor.
 
Persuaders never had a Q switch as a standard feature.

[Keith Wilson (darkbassist)]

i guess to see what the deal is, i could easily just take the pickups out and look for myself, but maybe it is something you can answer with out me having to.  if i put slight pressure on my pickups, they move down and then bounce back up as if it were a spring in there.  but i know you guys use a springless system.  have you always used this system, or is it a more recent addition?  seeing as how there is no spring, should the pickup move up and down when i press on it?  

[Keith Wilson (darkbassist)]

oh yeah... the jazz pickup doesn't move.  it is solid as a rock.  it is the p-pickup that moves.