Should I get an F1X?

[wayne]

It depends on what you want to send to FOH.

The few times I got to use mine live and wanted to send a post-EQ signal, I used all 3 outputs.  A to one power amp, B to another, and M (the mono) to the DI.  RonW confirmed to me that the only downside is that once you plug into the M output, there is some minor crosstalk between the other two.  Any that occurred, was not noticeable to me.

If the FOH wanted pre-EQ signal, I ran the auxiliary DS-5R outputs to a Radial JDI (merged inputs to mono out).

Of all the pre-amps I've tried, it still stands alone as the best tone.  ;-)

C-Ya..............wayne

[keith_h]

I've got a hookup on an F2B and will probably go that route.

Its really not clear to me though how I'd use this live..I know a DI box will be involved, but where in my signal chain would it go.  I use an effects board so that complicates things a little bit I guess.

Speaking as a soundman, I'd put the DI just before the power amp, so as to get same signal to my board that your amp is getting (and I'd run your channel EQ flat). 

Peter

When I run sound if I can only have one signal I want the opposite and to get my signal pre EQ so I have the full spectrum to work with. There are multiple reasons for this. First is if the bass player has mud then all I have to work with is mud but it won't be the bass player blamed for that situation instead it will be me. There is also the case of what sounds good on stage might might not sound good once the bass is sitting in the mix out front. The last one off the top of my head is going post EQ means every time the bass player changes settings on their amp I will have to compensate. That isn't too bad if they make a small adjustment here or there but you have your tweakers who will spend the whole night trying to find their tone and screwing up the rest of the mix.

My recommendation is if you can't get both a pre and post EQ is to go pre EQ between your effects and F2B input.

[JimmyJ]

Good discussion.  And I should recuse myself because I prefer the straight-up full-spectrum DI tone of my basses, both for live FOH and recording.  In fact, for a bass amp I prefer a full range monitor.  So take anything I add here with a grain of that salt...

I think guitar (and bass) amp tone controls were always meant to be used to compensate for the inefficiencies of guitar and bass speakers.  If I want to get more high and low end out of my little 12" EVM Thiele cabinets (which legally only deliver 80-7kHz) I need to gas the bass and treble controls on my Walter Woods amp.  If I sent that "post EQ" signal to the clubs PA, which has a much wider and flatter frequency response, it's going to be a pretty nasty tone.

I have the feeling that if you guys with these great preamps and filters were to go out in front of the PA and set your tone controls based on what you hear out there, it might be quite different from the settings you use for your onstage amp.  And it would probably change for every different room and PA where you tried that.

Just my spin... 

Jimmy J

[cozmik_cowboy]

Good discussion.  And I should recuse myself because I prefer the straight-up full-spectrum DI tone of my basses, both for live FOH and recording.  In fact, for a bass amp I prefer a full range monitor.  So take anything I add here with a grain of that salt...

I think guitar (and bass) amp tone controls were always meant to be used to compensate for the inefficiencies of guitar and bass speakers.  If I want to get more high and low end out of my little 12" EVM Thiele cabinets (which legally only deliver 80-7kHz) I need to gas the bass and treble controls on my Walter Woods amp.  If I sent that "post EQ" signal to the clubs PA, which has a much wider and flatter frequency response, it's going to be a pretty nasty tone.

I have the feeling that if you guys with these great preamps and filters were to go out in front of the PA and set your tone controls based on what you hear out there, it might be quite different from the settings you use for your onstage amp.  And it would probably change for every different room and PA where you tried that.

Just my spin... 

Jimmy J

One band I worked for, the bassist ran a tri-amped rack system; DI right off the instrument, no effects.  They got a new drummer, who had a pair of single-18" scoops - which, of course, we stuck into the PA.  The first night with that set-up, said bassist stepped out onto the dance floor:  Did a speakers>me>speakers triple take, kicked a chair in front of the stack, and finished the set sitting there (and smiling - big).  At the break he came over & kissed me (we're both straight), and only used one amp & a wedge as his rig for the rest of my time with that band.

He also hired me for 2 other bands.

Peter

[rv_bass]

I guess in my case it’s a little different in that more recently I tend to play (at least did pre-COVID) small jazz rooms with no PA and my amp and cab are my sound, so being able to adjust things with a nice preamp or filter helps.

[JimmyJ]

Rob,

Of course when playing a smaller room where you ARE the entire bass sound then you need to tweak it to have an inspirational tone.  I even cheat at the Baked Potato (legal capacity 60 people) and run through the PA at a level that almost matches my onstage amp.  Just part of my weirdness...

And like Peter's story, there was a moment in my early time with JT that I had a killer rig made up of two Meyer Sound UPA-1A two-way speakers and a USW-1 double 15" sub controlled by a Bagend ELF-1, tri-amped stereo, no other preamps or EQ just line level out of the Series bass pickups.  And it was a GLORIOUS sound.  But I soon realized I was making the crew drag around and set up all that gear and I was literally the only one in the room who could hear it.  Thank goodness in-ear monitors came along.  (I'm pretty sure the crew would agree.) 

Jimmy J

[jazzyvee]

Interesting Jimmy, I just looked them up and those weigh in at 67lbs and 205lbs with case. John Prock has been encouraging me to get Meyer powered cabs for my bass rig ever since I got my Series II bass. However, when i contacted the dealer in the UK, the rig he suggested was pretty close to the list price of a series bass. Added to that I'd never get them in my car, and like you say, i'd most likely be the only person in the venue hearing them. I'm happy with my barefaced cabs. :-)

[StephenR]

John showed me his Meyer rig when I was in Monterey recently. Sounded amazing, as expected, and relatively light/compact for Meyer gear. He has a small portable lift to get it into his vehicle, pretty sure the rig stays on the base of the lift when in use. If I remember correctly it would cost about $22-23,000. Seems like overkill now that there are better choices for bass gear available but no denying that it would be a lot of fun to gig with.

[cozmik_cowboy]

I have to say, Jimmy, that my story differs from yours slightly, in that I was not working for JT; that was a bar band, and not the most successful I worked with by far (heck, not even the most successful one I worked with for that bassist); the rooms we were playing*, I assure you everyone heard his rig!  But it gave him the best sound he could get from a rig, while I (and the 4-way, based-on-18s PA) gave him what he was trying for.........


*A fun aside:  That band once played a bowling league banquet in the former home of Alvah C. Roebuck; yes, as in "Sears &...".  The tables were set up in his bedroom & the band was in his dressing room.   Yeah, a whole bowling league, at banquet tables in his bedroom!


[size=78%]Peter[/size]