Setup after moving to Brazil

[marcio.esteves]

Hello there,
I bought this wonderful instrument - Essence 5 strings 35"scale - from a gentleman which lives in Arizona and I have it now in Rio de Janeiro, Brazil.
When It arrived, the setup was not to my taste (action to high) but I managed to get almost there by adjusting just the nut and bridge (no truss rod at that point). It was around 45 days ago.

Two weeks later (I just play on weekends) I found the strings hitting the scale all the way (unplayable) and sure I need to adjust truss rod due extreme change in humidity (Arizona =15% to Rio de Janeiro = 90%).

I followed the adjustment procedure with the nut/bridge and then start to adjust the truss rod, by small increments (1/8 to 1/4 turns, both truss rod screws at same) and waiting few hours between changes to leave the wood to accommodate.
This week (45 days from arrival) I reached the point where the truss rod screws are almost with no tension and still didn't get the neck ok when strings are in tune.

When I over-tension the strings by tuning at one pitch high (C#/F#/B/E/A) I got the neck with "almost" right curve.
My question: shall I leave one pitch high (C#/F#/B/E/A) for a day or so?
Any insight what else may I do?

Thank you!

[adriaan]

Pierre-Yves posted his solution to the problem with the truss-rods running out of adjustment for tenor tuning (A to C) - here:
http://club.alembic.com/index.php?topic=1494.msg17242#msg17242


Pics or it didn't happen ...



Apparently, it took 12 days ...

[lbpesq]

Marcio, I'd try Adriaan's suggestion first.  If that doesn't resolve the issue, another option is to find an experienced luthier and have a heat bend done on the neck.   I had it done to my custom Further.   Completely fixed the problem.   Fortunately for me, I live near Santa Rosa, so I had Alembic do it.

Bill, the guitar one

[marcio.esteves]

Adrian,  thanks a lot for the pic and post.
Bill, many thanks.
I'm applying same idea but slightly less strength, by pitching a note high, sitting the instrument by peg head and body and letting gravity do the job.
8 hours now and I can see is getting there...
So I'm pitching one note higher (destroy the strings.. I know) and will leave overnight.
Tomorrow I'll post here the results.

Cheers,

[adriaan]

Gravity doesn't do a whole lot here - string tension is a lot of pounds/kilograms more (20-25 pounds per string) than what the instrument weighs. Adding the book under the strings adds a couple of inches to the overall string length, and you can probably increase the tension by a few pounds more that way, without immediately breaking the string.


However, you must consider gravity when fine-tuning the action and neck bow. This needs to be done so it's correct for the instrument in playing position, not for the instrument lying on its back.

[marcio.esteves]

See your point about gravity.
Will use the book instead.  Place it around 10th freet?

[adriaan]

I haven't tried it myself, but it probably doesn't matter much where the book sits on the neck - it's probably fine when it is in line with the end of the fingerboard, as Pierre-Yves' picture shows. A nice fat paperback should do the trick.

[lbpesq]

I suspect the advantage gained by using the book is that it increases the angle of the strings relative to the neck, creating more of a forward pulling force. 

Bill, tgo

[jon_jackson]

I have used the technique shown in Pierre-Yves' picture on both short scale and long scale Alembics. Instead of a book, I use short sections of 1 x 2 (0.75" x 1.5") wood which can be stacked to the desired height on the fretboard and then removed gradually as the neck moves closer to the desired relief. I place them at the fret corresponding to the maximum relief point on the fretboard. It takes a few days to a week and occasionally requires a repeat (especially on short scales). On my 1976 S1 short scale, I originally thought I would have to send it in for a heat bend, but it now is fine with only light tension on the truss rod.
Jon

[marcio.esteves]

Thank you Jon, Bill and Adrian for helpful hints.

I left the bass sitting for 12 hours tuned at two notes high and the book (pics) as Pierre's solution.
It worked!
Now I have the right action when in tune with very little tension on the truss rods. Don't know if I should continue to increase the neck's curve and get more tension on the rods.
My thinking is to leave like this to check if neck is stable and if not, I'll repeat the procedure.

Any thoughts?

CHeers,
Marcio

[5a quilt top]

I live in Arizona and I constantly battle the effects of low humidity.


I have an enclosed room where I store my guitars and basses and I use a humidifier and a digital gauge to monitor the humidity, which I try to keep at (+/-) 40% year round. This can be challenging, especially in the drier months when the outside humidity can be as low as 8 - 10%.


Any wooden instrument that has been stored in Arizona for a long period of time will be in shock if it is transported to a place where the humidity is much higher. It may take several weeks / months before it stabilizes.


The same is true of wooden instruments that have been stored in areas with high humidity that are shipped to Arizona. There is always a period of adjustment and it is different for each instrument. In general, I've found that older instruments are usually more stable and they adapt more quickly, but virtually all instruments require an adjustment.


My suggestion is to make small adjustments and wait. Be patient and you should see the desired result. Alembics are high-quality instruments and they have been designed and built to withstand these extremes. Without exception, I've been able to achieve my preferred set-up on all my Alembics - but it sometimes requires more than one attempt.

[marcio.esteves]

I live in Arizona and I constantly battle the effects of low humidity.


I have an enclosed room where I store my guitars and basses and I use a humidifier and a digital gauge to monitor the humidity, which I try to keep at (+/-) 40% year round. This can be challenging, especially in the drier months when the outside humidity can be as low as 8 - 10%.


Any wooden instrument that has been stored in Arizona for a long period of time will be in shock if it is transported to a place where the humidity is much higher. It may take several weeks / months before it stabilizes.


The same is true of wooden instruments that have been stored in areas with high humidity that are shipped to Arizona. There is always a period of adjustment and it is different for each instrument. In general, I've found that older instruments are usually more stable and they adapt more quickly, but virtually all instruments require an adjustment.


My suggestion is to make small adjustments and wait. Be patient and you should see the desired result. Alembics are high-quality instruments and they have been designed and built to withstand these extremes. Without exception, I've been able to achieve my preferred set-up on all my Alembics - but it sometimes requires more than one attempt.

Thank you for your words and comprehensive post. I share the same opinion... let's not be to anxious and give the wood their time...

Cheers,
Marcio.

[marcio.esteves]

Ho Ho Ho,

I think now I can say for sure I have a happy Alembic.
After leaving the neck under over-tension using the book solution and slowly regulating the truss rod, now its perfect to my taste and stable tune.

Thanks to all and Merry Xmas!

[edwardofhuncote]

Now, get out there and play that beautiful creature. 

*I meant to post earlier, D'Addario makes this device that regulates an optimal humidity level when the instrument is cased.

http://www.planetwaves.com/pwMobileProductDetail.Page?productId=523&productname=Humidipak

I've never tried it, but I have a buddy who is into vintage Martin guitars that claims acceptable results.