Author Topic: "Professional" Ethics (Read 499 times)

drz · « **on:** May 31, 2004, 10:38:02 AM »

I have to tell you all this story. I shouldn't have been as shocked as I was this last weekend when I traveled to LA to do a showcase/video shoot. Yes it was a paid gig and we were to have 25 songs, original and covers, learned prior to the one rehearsal we had scheduled. I have done this many times before with other bands. You show up, rehearse the material as a band, and perform the show the next day. This is not rocket science. This time, however, I was in a room full of musicians who all had their noses planted in books and charts and they couldn't even fart their way out of a wet paper bag. I was assured they were the best A list players in LA but the reality was not the case. They could not play the songs let alone perform them. NOTE: There is a difference between playing and performance, right? Am I missing something? And not just playing but playing the material correctly with feel and integrity. Everyone involved in this nightmare was compensated for their work or lack thereof. I think the guy who paid them got hosed. A musician should be paid for what they do. If the job doesn't get done, they shouldn't get paid. It should be based on the outcome rather than the promise. These hired guns were theives as far as I am concerned, no integrity at all. Needless to say, the gig did not happen as a direct result of their lack of professionalism. I definitely have a new perspective on the hired gun chart readers. There are some who are gifted that handle the job and there are those who think they can but in reality can't, they just wish they could and are not honest with themselves or those who hire them. Frankly, they made themselves look like complete asses and tried to find every excuse they could come up with to justify their actions. Lets raise the bar people. Just had to vent that out.

dnburgess · « **Reply #1 on:** May 31, 2004, 03:53:42 PM »

Ron, that's an interesting story - certainly runs counter to the stories I've heard about the LA session scene - players sight reading very complex scores - but then that is film soundtrack work where time is very serious money. Even in Sydney I can't conceive of something like that happening with first call players.

Sounds like your musical director got the D list rather than the A list - and you ended up on the wrong list.

drz · « **Reply #2 on:** May 31, 2004, 04:01:37 PM »

So it would seem. I will have to do a bit more research next time. Definetely a jackassed gig.

88persuader · « **Reply #3 on:** June 01, 2004, 12:55:27 AM »

I've played on the Boston scene and have played with many young hired guns as well as seasoned vets. In Boston there are many music schools and therefore the level of musicianship is generally pretty high. If you want to work you have to read AND play. YOU HAVE TO BE SHARP! The best people I find to work with are the ones who can read but also have GREAT EARS. When you use the real book for example there's a lot of room for self expression and if you're not a real player things become one dimentional or worse.
I've also done a lot of hired gun work in the suburbs and southern NH with musicians who could read but couldn't play their way out of a paper bag. People with master's degrees in music but no talent on their instrument. And I'm talking not being able to play simple WEDDING MUSIC well! Thank GOD the $$$ is good at those gigs. Bottom line ... I'd much rather play with a musician with EARS than just reading ability anyday. After all, reading is required in some gigs however PLAYING is required in ALL gigs. And a smart producer or band leader will have their OWN A list musicians they trust.

Ray

dannobasso · « **Reply #4 on:** June 01, 2004, 07:12:09 AM »

I do sound for a wedding band in denial. They call themselves a club band. Some guys are great , the others hit so many clams I refer to them as the Sushi Squad. They play so freekin' loud I can't mix them right, and the band leader insists on giving mixing orders from behind the speakers on the bandstand. This is called the bloody mary mix because it gets worse after 2 or 3 of them. Most of them have degrees in music from various places including Berklee. BTW I believe that if you still have to read the charts to I will Survive after 15 years there is something severely wrong! IMO. If you hire a soundman, let them do their job unless they completely stink. Maybe the music schools could devise a course called Reality Check for those who will play at celebrations. Perhaps, You are not the center of attention, you are a live jukebox 101. I appologise for the venting
Danno

dela217 · « **Reply #5 on:** June 01, 2004, 09:02:41 AM »

Danno - That is funny! I really like the sushi squad. I can think of some folks here that fit that description. I really like the name of the class too. Aside from being a bassist, soundman, you really need to break into comedy!

Thanks!

alembic76407 · « **Reply #6 on:** June 01, 2004, 10:18:05 AM »

you know the old saying;
when the band sounds good, it's the band,
when the band sounds bad, it's the soundman

dannobasso · « **Reply #7 on:** June 01, 2004, 12:55:36 PM »

I also teach special ed emotionally disturbed teenagers. That lends itself to tons of comedic material. Some of the things they would not be believed. But 2 in-class support kids went on to Mahattan School of Music, / Julliard, and William Paterson University. Just don't ask them to spell or interact appropriately with others.
Danno

dean_m · « **Reply #8 on:** June 04, 2004, 01:33:10 PM »

Hey guys,

I've been a professional player on both coasts now. First in Boston, then in LA, now back in Boston.
Ron, I'm sorry to hear about your experience with the LA music scene. Unfortunately, in LA, EVERYONE is an A list player, if you catch my drift. (wink wink nudge nudge).
My idea of a TRUE pro is the person who comes into a gig or session and like you said, raises the bar. No matter what involvement they have, whether it be the musicians, the engineers or the producers. They give it 100% of their all. They bring everyone's level up. When that happens, it can be a religious experience!!! When it doesn't, it just becomes a job again. But that doesn't mean you can slack either. It's still up to you to be one of those that brings everyone's level up.
Hey Ray, where are you at in Boston? Maybe we've played with some of the same people.
BTW-Welcome to the ANEC

Peace,
Dino

keavin · « **Reply #9 on:** June 04, 2004, 02:15:47 PM »

I dont read music at all,but i'll play the $#@!%&^ out of my bass on any nite with any body!,,my ear has been my teacher for 30 yrs,but it also goes to show that just cause some can read,they can still learn alot from us natural players, some of the best players are not readers at all!

88persuader · « **Reply #10 on:** June 07, 2004, 06:19:27 AM »

Dino ........ I play in town quite a bit but I don't live IN Boston. I'm actually living north of Boston, in Lowell. I put Boston on my profile because I play there a lot plus nobody's ever heard of Lowell. Right now I'm doing a rock gig and it's all ear playing. Not too complex and only CLUB money ... but it's fun. Like when I was a kid ... big sound system, lights, etc. Geesh ... we even have groupies! :-) Not bad for 46 YO! :-) Almost all my Boston gigs were GB gigs. The last GB reading gig I did was with some VERY old jazz cats. (Real book #2) All retired players, a few were retired music teachers from Lowell U. All in their 60's and 70's. Nothing like doing swing with guys who LIVED it. It was a learning experience, it was very cool. I was the KID of the band by a wide margin at 46! And who knows Dino ... we probably have played with some of the same people. It's not THAT big of a town.

OK got to go for now ...

TTFN
Ray

dean_m · « **Reply #11 on:** June 07, 2004, 11:34:36 AM »

Geez Ray,

We might live on the same street even. I live in Lowell too. Give me a call when you can sometime!!!

(978)458-3620

Its a small world folks!!!

Dino

palembic · « **Reply #12 on:** June 07, 2004, 11:51:05 AM »

Brother Paul the fake one
(the artist formerly known as Dino - KTF)
WE live in the same street too ....
well ...
a shame of the big pool in the middle ...
...quite a BIG pool.
You need a boat to cross ...or a plane to fly ....but it IS the same street.
Oh yes ...and on your side it is called Lowell ... my side it is Sint Joris Weert.
Okay ...it changed continents too ...bu that is a MINOR inconvenient.

Paul the bad one

pace · « **Reply #13 on:** June 07, 2004, 07:49:53 PM »

I miss Lowell....... well, sometimes......

I remember playing at Smithwicks a few years back w/ a friends band & their bass player had a Persuader, but he was probably half Ray's age and from Leominster....

Anyways, its great to be surrounded by so many top notch musicians up there. Right now I'm two hours away from both Boston & NYC. The only times I'm ever really in either place is to play, so I miss going out and catching old familar faces night after night.....

-Mike

88persuader · « **Reply #14 on:** June 07, 2004, 08:30:07 PM »

Geesh .... never thought so many bass players in and around the Lowell area could afford Alembics! ...lol Small world indeed!!!! And Mike ... I got my 1st Alembic only last April so the guy at Smithwicks wasn't me ... now I've already bought my 3rd Alembic! :-) The guys I gig with think I'm crazy however they sure love the way my basses look and sound. And Dino ... I'll definitely give you a call sometime. Or you can come to one of my gigs. (or i can come to one of yours!) Right now the band I'm with is called One Fine Mess and generally we play at Pub 30 something, J Rags, Mickee's sports bar, the Fire Side, Club 251, Martha's Exchange in Nashua, The Horse Shoe in north Reading .......... more or less all over. You can check out our schedule on our website. onefinemess.com

Hope to meet you soon! Maybe I already have!

TTFN
Ray