Author Topic: What is with the "other" American bass manufacturers??  (Read 1109 times)

elzie

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What is with the "other" American bass manufacturers??
« on: October 06, 2006, 08:37:26 PM »
Okay, this is a non-Alembic rant.
 
I love to give business to my local music stores, but the total lack of Fenders and Gibsons/Epiphones is scary. I talk to the store owners and all I hear is that Fender and Gibson want sales of $60k and $90k respectively in order to be able to sell at the local stores. Are they crazy?? I know they do a good biz through musician's friend and all, but they are completely forgetting their core buyer! I will ALWAYS support a local biz before an online one. I also noticed that the prices of an American made Fender are absurd. It makes me glad I bought mine new back in '82 when they were actually affordable.
 
On a side note: Mica, if you read this, Setu says hi. He is working at my local store(who used to sell Alembics way back in the 80's) and we mention you every time I go in, so if your ears are burning, it's my fault ;)
 
 
Paul TGO

crgaston

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What is with the "other" American bass manufacturers??
« Reply #1 on: October 06, 2006, 09:23:45 PM »
Hi Paul.
 
I used to know a bass salesman and Alembic pusher named Seitu (I think that's how he spelled it??)  who worked in Atlanta in the '90's.  I wonder if it's the same guy.  He sold me my F1-X and my Modulus.  If it's him, say hi for me!
 
Charles

bigredbass

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What is with the "other" American bass manufacturers??
« Reply #2 on: October 07, 2006, 09:42:39 AM »
Elzie, I'd say it's a re-alignment of the store/manufacturer brought on by the megastore/internet-EBay era.
 
Here in Nashville, we have a huge Sam Ash and a Guitar Center as well.  Several local stores have closed over the last five years, just could not keep up.  Just like the way you always lose some local businesses when WalMart comes in.  The surviving local stores are either specialty (bass, vintage, acoustic) or pro shops that cater to the large 'been there, done that' crowd of pros that only go to a GC for strings or cables, if at all.  And for every graybeard like you and me that will support a local store, most people will mail order for $10 less (plus $50 S+H, never figured out how they ignore that part . . .).
 
A friend of mine who runs a Mom and Pop store outside Nashville was quoted a $175,000 fee to maintain his Gibson/Epiphone franchise.  Gibson was NOT willing to Epiphone-only, no custom shop-only, whatever, that would have allowed him to stay in the game.  So that was that.  Fender at this time seems to let you a bit more freedom and a lower buy-in, so he'll keep that, at least until they get completely unreasonable also.
 
On the other hand, it's hard to imagine the Gibsons and Fenders turning down the mail order money waved under their nose by the dumpster-full.  But they've gotten burned:  MARS and the BrookMays crashes have left them and their floor plan financiers holding big losses.  And once you're in bed with GC and some others, THEY tell YOU what you're gonna build and sell and how you're going to price it to them.
 
Music retail/wholesale is just one more business in a different model than the one we grew up with.  Like most things in life, change is better/change is worse/change is always.
 
J o e y

lbpesq

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What is with the "other" American bass manufacturers??
« Reply #3 on: October 07, 2006, 10:19:47 AM »
The Universe has a way of punishing Gibson.  They still have to deal with Ed Roman!  nyuk, nyuk
 
Bill, tgo

elzie

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What is with the "other" American bass manufacturers??
« Reply #4 on: October 07, 2006, 10:26:52 AM »
Yes Charles, it's the same guy

elzie

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What is with the "other" American bass manufacturers??
« Reply #5 on: October 07, 2006, 10:32:46 AM »
Joey, I think you are right on with your assesment. I will add, though, that it is us graybeards that typically have the cashflow to spend on new equipment. The other point, which is very important to me, but apparently not to a lot of others is that I want to actually play and feel a bass that I'm thinking of purchasing before I drop the cash on it.  Maybe it's just me, but I'm kind of kooky like that....
 
It is just a shame to walk into a store and not see the guitars that made rock and roll what it was. Most of us here have, or do have, Fender/Gibson/Epiphone etc....
 
 
Paul TGO

811952

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What is with the "other" American bass manufacturers??
« Reply #6 on: October 07, 2006, 11:43:55 AM »
One of my bandmates runs a reasonably successful music store.  He started out in the early '70s, starving and gigging to keep the rent paid.  These days he is a dealership for several lines (not Fender, nor Gibson), but his bread and butter is the used market, which treats him well (because he really knows his stuff, in addition to being a shrewed negotiator).  He's sold stuff to a who's who of guitarists and bassists, which would never happen if he were focusing his business on selling new Fenders or Gibsons.  If you are looking for something old and cool (and American made for the most part), he's the guy to talk to.
 
I think the net result of manufacturers' draconian inventory/cashflow policies are that new players (younguns') are not going to buy that first Strat or Les Paul and develop the brand loyalty us older folks tended to harbour.  Like Joey says, change is always...
 
John

elwoodblue

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What is with the "other" American bass manufacturers??
« Reply #7 on: October 07, 2006, 03:46:31 PM »
John,
 Does your friend have a website?

811952

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What is with the "other" American bass manufacturers??
« Reply #8 on: October 07, 2006, 05:11:51 PM »
Not one worth visiting.  I'll post his number though when I find it.  He's on my voice dial as Beeson and I don't have my cell or a phonebook handy at the moment.
 
John

bigredbass

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What is with the "other" American bass manufacturers??
« Reply #9 on: October 07, 2006, 09:44:18 PM »
No you're not just kooky like that, Elzie.  I prefer to hold the axe in my hand too, to see if the weight is OK and to check grain in the neck and fingerboard.
 
Admittedly, I guess I could buy an 'off the rack' Tele, PBass, what have you over the 'net, but I REALLY don't understand buying serious vintage or custom axes sight-unseen.  I would only trust ALEMBIC to buy from 'blind', as I know what's coming.
 
I have fabulous friends and service from Corner Music and Will Gunn Guitars here in Nashville:  I can call, ask them for anything, and it's DONE.  You just can't beat that person-to-person relationship, or the knowledge and experience.  Will KNOWS his Alembics, and Corner has been a huge help for everything else.
 
J o e y

hankster

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What is with the "other" American bass manufacturers??
« Reply #10 on: October 08, 2006, 06:06:18 AM »
I agree - I find the mail order instrument market a bit wierd (although I bought my Alembic from a seller on Ebay).  When I was a kid, music stores were full of all kinds of diabolically terrible guitars and basses that were virtually unplayable - but there were always one or two Gibsons or Fenders, or more affordable Hagstroms or Hofners, that you could actually touch, and get some idea what a decent instrument felt like.  Small town music stores today, it seems, can't afford that.
 
Rick
Live each day like your hair is on fire.

dannobasso

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What is with the "other" American bass manufacturers??
« Reply #11 on: October 08, 2006, 08:08:58 AM »
Virtually all of the stores by me Ash, GC, Victors and O'DiBella have online as well as walk in. Mind you In Bergen County we have these plus a few smaller ones all within a 12 miles radius. Unless you develop a personal relationship with the managers and staff if really is a bother going in and asking for something. I was in GC in Totowa (don't really know anyone) looking at a SCBB where the slick salesman tried to tell me that the Alembic bolt ons are pretty good but not as good as what he had hanging up for $3400. I told him he wasn't quite accurate on that. He insisted he knew what he was talking about. I walked away. He didn't even try to take the Stanley down for me to try out. Ash can't carry new Gibsons anymore so they are always looking for used gear.  
Maybe after I get close to retirement, I'll open up a boutique shop and sell Alembics if the powers in Santa Rosa approve. I promise to beat the competition! That is if I don't keep buying them for myself.

811952

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What is with the "other" American bass manufacturers??
« Reply #12 on: October 08, 2006, 10:36:13 AM »
elwoodblue,
 
John Beeson, 812-232-4095.  He owns The Music Shoppe in Terre Haute, Indiana, and deals in vintage instruments...
 
John

elzie

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What is with the "other" American bass manufacturers??
« Reply #13 on: October 08, 2006, 04:44:37 PM »
Rick, I have to admit that I bought both of my Alembics off of ebay. I paid $900 for each of them too! When I bought the first one years ago, I remember saying to myself what can go wrong, it's an Alembic. If it has problems I can sell it for what I paid.
 
Well, I was completely thrilled with both of them. I figured an abused Alembic would be better than any new bass. The Excel was perfect, the Epic had human and food goo in the oddest of places and needed an extended cleaning.  
 
I admit, I did buy an Epiphone EB-O from musician's friend because I couldn't find a local dealer who carried them. I had a Gibson EB-O in high school (yes, they were around waaaay back then) and the Epi version comes pretty close to the old Gibson I had. I would just rather give my money to a local business, or even far away business, if it were not a large corporation.....

richbass939

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What is with the "other" American bass manufacturers??
« Reply #14 on: October 09, 2006, 09:24:15 AM »
I also admit that I bought both of my Alembics long distance from a description and picture only.  
As far as the business deal goes, I felt pretty good about not getting ripped off.  One was from an established guitar shop that sold the bass on e-bay and took a credit card over the phone.  The other was from a club member.  I checked with people who I knew had done bass business with him.  They all said he was a straight-up guy.
As far as the instruments go, I bought them based on the Alembic reputation.  I was so thrilled to find out that Alembics could be purchased second hand for such reasonable prices that I had to take the plunge.  I have never before bought an instrument that I didn't spend an hour or so playing.  My Epics (even though they are at the lower end of Alembic's line) are the finest basses I have owned. I'm glad that I got an Alembic even though I had to assume some risk.  
When a company has such an excellent reputation I think it is worth a little bit more of a risk.  I live in the boonies.  If I had to wait until I saw one in a shop I would probably still be waiting.  
Rich