Author Topic: Disappointed (Read 552 times)

Bradley Young · « **Reply #15 on:** February 28, 2007, 01:50:38 PM »

Joe,

That security clearance will do you a lot more good (in life) than learning to throw a grenade.

Like Alan, I'm a Desert Storm Vet, and Combat Infantryman's Badge holder (but no Bronze Star!).

I was an 11M (mechanized infantry), and can confirm that it seemed romantic at first, but didn't continue to seem that way while I was watching approaching scuds get shot down.

Godspeed, whatever happens.

Bradley

lbpesq · « **Reply #16 on:** February 28, 2007, 03:37:44 PM »

Doc:

Again I ask: Who is 'them'? Our gov't told us we went there to fight Saddam (who had nothing to do with 9/11) and stop his WMD programs. It's now several years later. No WMDs. Saddam is dead. Saddam's gov't is dead. Who is them?

Bill, tgo

alembic_doctor · « **Reply #17 on:** February 28, 2007, 05:04:05 PM »

Bill. Start another thread please. aj's thread should not be hijacked for the debate that is about to ensue.

ajdover · « **Reply #18 on:** February 28, 2007, 06:15:27 PM »

Bill,

My intent in responding was to convey advice from an older man to a younger man. Didn't intend to start a political debate - perhaps we should take this offline. Email me and I'd be happy to share a few thoughts with you if I may and if you're interested. This, IMHO, is not the place for political threads as they tend to ingnite passions in all of us, and I'd rather not go down that route. Looking back on it, I probably should have sent Joe an email, and left it out of public debate here. I will certainly do just that in the future.

Best regards,

Alan

lbpesq · « **Reply #19 on:** February 28, 2007, 06:25:33 PM »

Alan:

'nuff said.

Bill, tgo

alembic_doctor · « **Reply #20 on:** February 28, 2007, 06:25:59 PM »

Thank you Alan. I don't think this is a wholly unappropriate place for debate such as this. I do think that hijacking the thread of one of our beloved defenders for this debate is bad form though.

I would like to hear what you (Alan) have to say. And I would like to debate Bill too. Let's just do it on another thread or another forum.

I don't think that Mica would mind this.

David Houck · « **Reply #21 on:** February 28, 2007, 06:41:37 PM »

From my position as moderator, I most humbly request that this debate not be continued in this or any other thread on this forum.

It's certainly an important debate; and as a human being who cares about all of the other human beings on this planet, I have been and continue to be very vocal and active in this debate.

But not here.

And while I am sure that many members of this board are indeed capable of having a civil discussion on such an emotionally charged subject, experience suggests that, for the good of this board as a whole, such discussions be held elsewhere.

And again, it's not because I don't think it's important; and I do indeed believe that educating people on this subject is very important. And I've been educating my congressman about this subject at his office twice in the last three weeks.

But as a moderator of this particular board, and given what I perceive as my responsibility to the board, its hosts, and its members, I don't think that discussion should be held here.

David Houck · « **Reply #22 on:** February 28, 2007, 06:54:49 PM »

I should add that I completely understand why Bill and Doc would feel compelled to post as they did. And it would be understandable if they, or anyone else, disagreed with my position on this. I'm just trying to be the moderator.

And just to be clear, my comments about the debate should not be construed to include Alan's response to Joe; which I found to be not only appropriate given the context of the thread to that point, but quite valuable in my own quest to become better informed on the subject.

lbpesq · « **Reply #23 on:** February 28, 2007, 07:21:53 PM »

Dave:

I've been waiting for you and your inevitable injection of calm and reason. I knew it was coming, just not when. You are right, of course, that this is neither the time nor the place and I will endeavor to place my bi-cuspids back into my lingual flesh. Before signing off, however, I would like to make one point: I think we should all be proud of this forum that we can even brush against this topic without losing civility and respect for each other. Though I disagree with others, it does nothing to diminish the comraderie I feel with all of my fellow Alembic nuts. If only Congress could get along so well ... oops ... never mind. LOL

Apologies to all.

Joe: The best of luck in your future endeavors, whatever direction they may take, and may you lead a long, healthy, happy, and fulfilling life.

Bill, tgo

the_8_string_king · « **Reply #24 on:** February 28, 2007, 07:47:16 PM »

Hmm. That's a shame. I understand the logic of taking up the issue on a separate thread, but it's a shame it can't be discussed here. I personally found all viewpoints expressed important, and was looking forward to the intelligent and civilized responses of the other members. But it's your perrogative, of course.

On a different note, my experience -and I was raised in a military family- is that the overwhelming majority of the people in the military -at least the ones I've met- really believe they're fighting for this country, and fighting for freedom. I think the brave soldiers -and civilian contractors- risking their lives there believe that they're trying to bring freedom to Iraq. The sad thing is that while they're over there risking their lives for freedom over their -for us- freedom is being dismantled here as we speak... as I write this, and as you read it.

Our soldiers deserve so much better. If they can risk their lives and die in a far off country in the name of freedom, then we can certainly take the equally-if-not-even-more important and/yet much less risky step of forcing the status quo to change for the better -BY USING OUR ABILITY TO VOTE and to holding the government responsable for when they break the law. We can change things.

Every citizen who respects the courage and sacrifice of those in the military should show it by VOTING and by VOTING SMART. Vote out those that are part of the problem. Hold government officials accountable for their actions when THEY break the law. Remove people from office that commit treason against the citizens.

The problems go on because we let them... because we don't put a stop to them, either because we're lazy, stupid, or both. The best way to honor the military, to honor the people who've died, who've been crippled and maimed, and who risk such -is to USE the system... the LEGACY that they fought and died for... to peacefully and democratically change the system by the use of ideas, free exchange and assembly, and voting.

ajdover · « **Reply #25 on:** February 28, 2007, 07:49:05 PM »

Doc,

Email me if you wish to discuss further privately.

Alan

811952 · « **Reply #26 on:** March 01, 2007, 07:07:18 AM »

Posted on Wednesday, February 28, 2007 - 8:47 am:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
John,

Thanks. Care to give up that Series 1 1/2 to a deserving vet? Ahh, Damn, that's what I thought! I'll have to satisfy myself with my Essesnces, the SC Sig Del,the DW, the Spyder, the Europa, and my incoming Series II.

I'm proud to know you through this forum as well.

Alan

I'm sure we could work out some sort of trade..

You're welcome to use it anytime you're in the area!

John

jack · « **Reply #27 on:** March 01, 2007, 01:40:51 PM »

Applejuice,

Just saying hello from one Echo to another. I bought my Alembic down the hill from DLI. I've got fond memories of them times.

-Jack

applejuice · « **Reply #28 on:** March 01, 2007, 03:07:37 PM »

Jack, I cannot wait to get there. What language did you learn?

jack · « **Reply #29 on:** March 02, 2007, 09:04:34 AM »

Russian.

Also played a lot of music out there. There's one bar, can't remember the name but on the same strip as a place called the British Bulldog that does open jams once a week, a great way to meet other musicians. I met a lot of people and got into a decent gig backing a woman singer/songwriter that way. Also the Army has a rec center there with instruments and amps. Ten years ago they did, anyway.

I also recommend doing some volunteering, depending on where your other interests lie. A lot of people carried scorecards for the Pebble Beach golf tournies. I worked for a big brother type thing, where we sold tickets at laguna seca and got to go to a lot of the races for free. We'd camp all weekend, BBQ and booze. It was cool, standing on the line selling tickets, and these people drive up in car clubs, so all of a sudden you'd get the deafening roar of a dozen Panteras all racing up the hill together. Neat, if you're into that sort of thing. My favorite were the classic races, with that old guy in an old BMW 2002 just outdriving all the camaros and firebirds. But the AMA races brought out the crowds, the sponsors, and the girls.

Man, I'd like be 19 again, under the trees overlooking the famous corkscrew on a hot sunday afternoon with a coolerfull of bud and an eyeful of bikinis.

Gotta get out of this office in mid-town manhattan, they're killing me.

-Jack