Author Topic: Inverted 5th tuning (Read 240 times)

88persuader · « **on:** March 22, 2007, 10:59:49 PM »

Recently I've gotten a renewed interest in Chapman Sticks. As a matter of fact I ordered one. I kick myself for selling the one I had a few years ago. It'll take 10 or more months to be built which is good ... gotta save up the $$. BUT for any of you who might be interested the bass strings on a Chapman Stick are usually tuned in inverted 5ths rather then normal decending 4ths like a bass guitar. Just to get the feel of inverted 5ths I tuned one of my cheap basses in inverted 5ths, it's VERY interesting. Playing normal scales is harder but the notes are much further apart tone wise and it makes for GREAT one hand chords where the notes don't sound mushy. The more I play with inverted 5ths the more I'm thinking I may try using the tuning on the 5 string bass I use in my band. (A non Alembic) I don't think it's really worth it on a 4 string bass but on a 5 or more string bass the possibilities with inverted 5ths tuning seem VERY interesting. It has the potential of creating a whole new role for the bass guitar. Has anyone else had experiences with inverted 5ths tuning? If you haven't and you have an extra bass kicking around i highly recommend giving it a try. The LOW bass sting is on the bottom of the neck going up if you try it inverted and it's tuned to a low C, the next is a G, the next is a D, the next is an A and the thin high tuned string is an E. As you notice it LOOKS like the same tuning as a normal 5 string bass starting with the E string however in this case the E string is the thin high pitch string and the 1st string on the bottom of the neck is the THICK string tuned to a low C, not a thin string high C. If nothing else it's mind blowing playing with this tuning. Personally I'm playing the bass vertically like a Chapman Stick so I can also get use to the hand to neck relationship. Again for anyone looking to try somthing different ... try this. With this tuning you can play bass AND melody chords that don't sound like mud. It's VERY interesting!!!

harald_rost · « **Reply #1 on:** March 23, 2007, 12:45:59 AM »

Raymond, what kind of Stick did you order. 10 or 12 stings, wood, bamboo or graphite?
I have a ten string rosewood with PASV-4 pickup. Great instruments but another world than basses.
It took a long time for me to get familiar with the 5th tuning. Also another world for me. The pro is that you can play nice chords easily but you have long ways to go to play a rock'n roll riff.
Harald

88persuader · « **Reply #2 on:** March 23, 2007, 02:28:06 AM »

Hi Harald,
I ordered a 10 string, light bamboo, black linear fret markers, black tuners, ACTV-2 block pick-up in deep baratone melody / standard (Stick) bass tuning. As I mentioned in the 1st post I HAD a Stick a few years ago, a used polycarbonate Stick in Standard Stick tuning. It didn't have the adjustable bridge so I couldn't change the tuning because it would throw off the intonation. So I sold it for what it cost me and ordered a new Stick. While waiting I saw a different companies tap instrument at 1/2 the price of a stick with 4ths tuning and canceled my Stick order and bought it. BAD MOVE!!!!! It was made well but the neck was twice the width of a Stick (Or at least it felt that way) so I couldn't play it. I traded it in on a bass guitar and here I am a few years later still wanting a Stick ... so I ordered mine two weeks ago. But back to the inverted 5ths tuning, I KNOW from having the Polycarb for a month or so how hard it is to get the HEAD into the idea of inverted 5ths. That's why I changed my cheap bass to inverted 5ths tuning ... so I can work on it before my Stick is ready. I realize the disavantages in regard to scale and riff work but it opens a big world in regard to taking a different approach in the bass guitar. I definitely think it's a worth while experiment for anyone! And of course a VERY worth while thing to do for any future Stick owner.

Anyway this isn't a Stick forum so enough about Sticks ......... but I honestly think inverted 5ths and the extended range bass guitar can make for interesting bed fellows!

pace · « **Reply #3 on:** March 23, 2007, 04:01:33 AM »

Alot of my knowledge of stacked 5ths comes from mandolin and tenor banjo.... All those voicings and positions should transfer over easily, but I havent tried it on an instrument w/ a 30-34 scale length.

I would love to see someone order a SII 8string mandocello someday!

adriaan · « **Reply #4 on:** March 23, 2007, 04:04:41 AM »

An inverted fifth - isn't that a fourth? Sorry - couldn't resist.

88persuader · « **Reply #5 on:** March 23, 2007, 04:58:28 AM »

Yeah I guess it is! :-) Of course the inverted part is the lowest string is the C and the higest string is the E. And the E is closest the roof and the C ... the lowest bass string is closest to the floor if you're holding it BASS style. So coming from the ground up kit's 5ths. But you knew that ... right? :-) I'll tell ya ... it's a strange new world!

adriaan · « **Reply #6 on:** March 23, 2007, 05:17:04 AM »

I guessed as much - just a small joke from a stuck-in-the-mud 4 string player.

blazer · « **Reply #7 on:** March 24, 2007, 06:10:00 PM »

88, you might want to check out Warr guitars, they are from the same principle of the Chapman stick but built like alembics with the Hippy sandwhich and all.
http://www.warrguitars.com/WarrRSS/Warr%20Guitars.html

King Crimson's Trey Gunn plays them.

hieronymous · « **Reply #8 on:** March 24, 2007, 08:31:36 PM »

I have never experimented with inverted tunings - in fact, never thought about it until now! But I do like tuning in 5ths. I started playing mandolin a few years ago, and always thought it might be neat to try it on bass. I finally did last year. It actually makes a lot of sense on a 4-string - you can almost have the same range as a 5-string bass but on a 4-string. I had mine tuned C-G-D-A, using a low-B string from a 5-string set. I'd also like to try having something more like a tenor/cello tuning - not worry about the low strings and just do the tenor range. I guess that's where ERBs start to get interesting...

There's a great band called Behold... The Arctopus, and the bassist uses a Warr guitar. I listen to that and think, I'd like to try and make sounds like that, but it's such a different mindset, I'll stick with bass and synths for now...

hankster · « **Reply #9 on:** March 24, 2007, 08:33:51 PM »

There is some beautiful Stick playing on Bruce Cockburn's Stealing Fire. In the right hands, it is something to behold.

rick

88persuader · « **Reply #10 on:** March 24, 2007, 10:40:07 PM »

Warr guitars are beautiful but I prefer The Stick. It lacks the woodwork of a Warr Guitar but I believe it's Sound is more distinct PLUS it's the original dedicated tap instrument still made by the man who INVENTED the instrument and actual playing technique. I could be mistaking but I THINK Mark Warr (I think his name is Mark) actually worked for Emmitt Chapman before starting Warr guitars. So you know where he got HIS inspiration from. I think in years to come Chapman Sticks that are actually made by Emmitt Chapman personally (Like mine will be) could be worth a small fortune. Maybe not for me ... but for my grand children, a true original, a collector's item.

hieronymous · « **Reply #11 on:** March 24, 2007, 11:22:31 PM »

Here's a cool website dedicated to Emmett Chapman - there's some really interesting stuff in there!

Looking forward to hearing how it goes. I think it's cool that you've strung up a bass that way! Definitely nice to get a new perspective sometimes...

88persuader · « **Reply #12 on:** March 25, 2007, 11:29:26 AM »

Stringing the bass like that is a mind blower and definitely gives a new perspective. In regard to how it goes with the Stick, I won't be reporting on that any time soon. It takes 10 or more months for the average build time. It's one of the MAJOR drawbacks to Stick Enterprises staying a small family business. 30 years later they still literally hand make each one in their HOUSE WORKSHOP! Buttttttttttt that's also why they're so special. Emmitt's got to be in his 60's or 70's now. Makes me wonder what's going to happen when nature takes it's course and he's gone. Another reason I think a hand made Stick made by Emmitt himself will become a collector's item. And in regard to time frame ... Warr guitars take just as long to get once you order them.