Author Topic: Entwistle Question (Read 126 times)

bigredbass · « **on:** July 10, 2010, 04:57:32 PM »

I just noticed something today, and thought I might lean on some of our John Entwistle experts . . .

I was always struck that his live tone bordered on sounding clavinet-like, VERY spikey tone. While listening to 'Who's Next' today, it occurred to me that his tone there and most recordings I could think of, were a more traditional sound, even on some real workouts like 'The Real Me' from 'Quadrophenia'. I'm assuming, of course, that the famous ad libs in 'My Generation' were a fuzz-tone or the awful amps of those days.

So what was the disconnect between his live attack and this more subdued tone on recordings?

J o e y

cool_hand_luke_fancy · « **Reply #1 on:** July 10, 2010, 06:06:36 PM »

Well on Who's Next he did use his Frankenstein P-bass which had the slab pick-up and electronics and that's what really defined his sound from 1967-1971. He described his Quadrophenia/Fenderbird equalizer as basically flat. Some of the spike you might be hearing on the live records would be him using a pick and cranked treble all the way up. But then again I don't have all the answers.

I have the Thunderfingers DVD of John Entwistle and in the interview he said he had something like an 18 speaker cabinet whose speaker hung on a nail inside the cabinet in the early days of The Who which gave it a rattling almost distorted sound.

cool_hand_luke_fancy · « **Reply #2 on:** July 10, 2010, 06:13:50 PM »

Well on Who's Next he did use his Frankenstein P-bass which had the slab pick-up and electronics and that's what really defined his sound from 1967-1971. He described his Quadrophenia/Fenderbird equalizer as basically flat. Some of the spike you might be hearing on the live records would be him using a pick and cranked treble all the way up. Plus he needed the treble and the distortion to cut through the rest of the band when playing live. In studio it all gets mixed. But then again I don't have all the answers.

I have the Thunderfingers DVD of John Entwistle and in the interview he said he had something like an 18 speaker cabinet whose speaker hung on a nail inside the cabinet in the early days of The Who which gave it a rattling almost distorted sound.

EDIT: Sorry for the double-post, something screwed up.

(Message edited by cool_hand_luke_fancy on July 10, 2010)

hieronymous · « **Reply #3 on:** July 10, 2010, 07:07:20 PM »

Wasn't that always a problem on the early stuff? Pinball Wizard for example - the studio recording has a very traditional bass sound, without the clang and overdrive. Engineers didn't know what to do with the band! Even Pete's guitar sound was off the radar for most of the engineers in the '60s. My Generation seems to be an exception, but he worked really hard on that one - wasn't it a Danelectro, and he kept breaking strings, so they kept using a new bass?!!

ajdover · « **Reply #4 on:** July 10, 2010, 07:58:17 PM »

I'm sure Oliver will be along shortly to set everyone straight .... ;-)

As for My Generation, that was recorded using a Fender Jazz Bass. He was using Danos, but the strings kept breaking and he couldn't find replacements, so he went to the Jazz.

As for Pinball Wizard, I think that was his '64 Thunderbird. Or at least that's what it sounds like to me. Same goes for The Real Me. I have a '76 Thunderbird, and that's exactly what it sounds like to my ears.

Oliver! We need your help!

Alan

senmen · « **Reply #5 on:** July 11, 2010, 02:31:06 AM »

Hi Guys,
everything true what was said yet.
He definetely had a rather traditional sound through that days. It changed with the Alembics. BTW Quadrophenia was re-recorded for the film and John used his Alembic for that which you can significantly hear.
But generally you might not forget that in the old days he had cranked up his amps to 11 with full treble on on the bass and amp. But you need not to forget his technique when playing with fingers as that produced plenty of ringing highs.
Oliver (Spyderman)

zn_bassman · « **Reply #6 on:** July 22, 2010, 01:00:53 PM »

My Generation: the release version was with a Jazz with La Bella strings.

Tone: He often used a trebly tone when recording, but the engineers over-rode and finalized with traditional tones. Listen to the alernate takes from Who's Next to hear how his authentic tone sounded with his T-Bird. All 4 original members lamented their album tone in interviews.

hieronymous · « **Reply #7 on:** July 23, 2010, 09:43:14 AM »

Thanks for correcting me on My Generation guys - sorry about that!

All 4 original members lamented their album tone in interviews. It strikes me as increditble that this amazing band of innovators were over-ridden by close minded traditionalists?!!

zn_bassman · « **Reply #8 on:** July 24, 2010, 01:43:14 PM »

Indeed. But the producers and record company execs apparently weren't ready to put the real Who sound on studio albums. There are some exceptions on The Who Sell Out and a few singles from that period. The reason the Tommy album didn't have the aggressive edge like the live versions is that it wasn't completed before release (they had more electric guitar and vocal tracks to add, and more mixing to do, but they ran out of money). Entwistle didn't get his tone on vinyl until much later, after their greatest work was already history - so he usually sounded almost like Jamerson or John Paul Jones. Live at Leeds was the main exception.

Chris Squire and Geddy Lee had their tones on studio vinyl before Entwistle did. Ironic...