Author Topic: Old basses being sold for silly money  (Read 1349 times)

Glynn

  • club
  • Advanced Member
  • *
  • Posts: 470
Old basses being sold for silly money
« on: March 28, 2011, 02:44:33 AM »
This is only my opinion and one I have expressed before - how can ordinary old Fender basses attract such high prices?  Here is a picture of one (1969) that is up for sale in a shop for ?3750!! Who in their right mind would pay that money for a bass that has not been looked after and been knocked about - I don't buy the 'oh, it's been played a lot and has a unique sound etc' theories.  It will have been an ordinary bass guitar that we all had (I bought one new in 1968 - subsequently stolen) and it was a good working bass that did me many happy gigs BUT it was ordinary - a bit like saying now that the Austin Mini was a fantastic motor.  I had one of those as well - it was fine BUT ORDINARY- everyone had one.  For ?3750 you can buy a new Alembic - I rest my case.  We should stop encouraging these stupid prices by not buying them thinking that one is buying a bit of history.  Rubbish - they were ORDINARY basses and there were loads of them.  That is my Monday morning rant over.  Glynn

dela217

  • club
  • Senior Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1313
Old basses being sold for silly money
« Reply #1 on: March 28, 2011, 03:36:58 AM »
I agree completely.  To me the bass pictured is worth $300.00, tops.

jacko

  • club
  • Senior Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4068
Old basses being sold for silly money
« Reply #2 on: March 28, 2011, 04:32:37 AM »
Glynn, your Mini analogy doesn't work as prices for 80's mini's has skyrocketed. A 1980 mini 1000 is currently going for ?3500 in lancashire! Wish i'd kept my clubman estate - it would be worth thousands today.
 
Graeme

keith_h

  • club
  • Senior Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3490
Old basses being sold for silly money
« Reply #3 on: March 28, 2011, 05:52:47 AM »
Speaking of Austin. I drove a 1970 Austin America (essentially an export version of the Austin 1300) during high school. Last I looked at prices they are $1500-$2500. Not much more than the new price in 1970.  
 
Keith

terryc

  • club
  • Senior Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2488
Old basses being sold for silly money
« Reply #4 on: March 28, 2011, 06:17:10 AM »
I agree murray, old basses & guitars are ridiculousy priced, okay the exceptions would be the first ten strats/p & j basses, first ten Les Pauls etc but all the 1000's made after that is just a 'rose tinted glasses' ideom.
It is a known fact that pick ups diminish in power as the magnets become weak, the pots deteriorate with use, the finish can crack or come off, the necks can warp.
I know one guy who says his old Strat sound better than the new ones then puts it through a BOSS processor! It could be a catalogue guitar as far as the audience is concerned.
I also don't believe in the mystique of artist owned  instruments either, it's wood, metal and plastic and the only thing it absorbs is sweat off their hands.

dela217

  • club
  • Senior Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1313
Old basses being sold for silly money
« Reply #5 on: March 28, 2011, 06:44:55 AM »
I guess I just don't get the whole vintage Fender thing.  It seems to me you can pick up a MIM Fender for a fraction of these prices and they are nice instruments for what they are. Not my cup of tea though.  
 
It's nice to see how this thread went from basses to Minis. I still have my 80's Mini 1000. Fun  car. I live in the US so mini prices are unrealistic due to availibility here.

hydrargyrum

  • club
  • Senior Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1242
Old basses being sold for silly money
« Reply #6 on: March 28, 2011, 07:09:20 AM »
Once upon a time there was a phenomenon where a really good instrument would be played so frequently that it was subjected to high levels of wear, and consequently showed it's pedigree in every piece of chipped paint and dings.  Now people pay to have this simulated with belt sanders and shop tools.  Frankly, I don't get it.  Now every abused instrument is a relic, and I can't help but wonder if you beat the crap out of it, whether the value improves.  Fender made some nice guitars, but they also sold a boat load of average ones.  You never know for sure until you try it.

hifiguy

  • club
  • Advanced Member
  • *
  • Posts: 462
Old basses being sold for silly money
« Reply #7 on: March 28, 2011, 09:02:22 AM »
This has always puzzled me to the nth degree.  A typical Fender is still a typical Fender even if it's 40 years old - no better and maybe worse for the wear and tear.
 
I've had a FOJ Jazz for more than ten years and it is hands down the best J of the six I have owned over the years.
 
Leo would doubtless find this frenzy both foolish and amusing.  He was in the business of building reliable tools for working musicians to use, not collector's items.
 
I guess I get it a bit more about 1950s Gibsons, especially Les Pauls.  There just weren't that many of them made back in the day, and they do sound special, but 1960s-70s Fenders are common as muck.  Some are good, some are bad, many are indifferent.

white_cloud

  • Guest
Old basses being sold for silly money
« Reply #8 on: March 28, 2011, 10:49:48 AM »
I guess any item that is for sale is worth however much a buyer is prepared to spend at that particular time.
 
I can only really comment on my own experiences - my 6 year old Korean built Lakland Darryl Jones is easily the finest jazz bass I have ever played (and I have played a few)...and that includes my now sought after  76 Fender Jazz. In fact the 76 is not a patch on the Lakland in any department.
 
Go figure!

jazzyvee

  • club
  • Senior Member
  • *
  • Posts: 8728
  • Bass, Guitar, Preamps.
Old basses being sold for silly money
« Reply #9 on: March 28, 2011, 01:02:44 PM »
I wonder how much an old and beaten up Alembic Series I from the 70's would go for? and..... have alembic ever made a new, beaten up bass or guitar for a customer?
 
 
Jazzyvee
The sound of Alembic is medicine for the soul!
http://www.alembic.com/info/fc_ktwins.html

elwoodblue

  • club
  • Senior Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2784
Old basses being sold for silly money
« Reply #10 on: March 28, 2011, 01:16:39 PM »
In this thread, Dadabass2001 speaks of one...too bad there are no pics of the process....or maybe there is ?

tncaveman

  • club
  • Advanced Member
  • *
  • Posts: 351
Old basses being sold for silly money
« Reply #11 on: March 28, 2011, 08:24:20 PM »
A friend of mine has 3 late 50's strats that he has owned and played for the past 30 + years and they do play nice and have an awesome sound.  And so do his Marshall stacks.  A item is only worth what someone is willing to pay.
 
BTW, why do a lot of the Alembics go for way less than a new one?  I paid $2000 for my Rogue.  the guy I got it from payed $2800 in 98 for it.  
 
Stephen
Prog Rock - Jazz Fusion fan living in the Heart of Country Music

bigredbass

  • club
  • Senior Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3033
Old basses being sold for silly money
« Reply #12 on: March 29, 2011, 12:09:39 AM »
Stephen, typically used ALEMBICs (and most 'boutique' basses) depreciate in big percents (thank goodness for me . . .) as the costs involved are way above what a Fender or Gibson runs as costs.  There's often no two alike, aside from basic shapes/templates and electronic packages.  The wood costs are much higher.  There's fewer employees who are much higher-skilled who do a lot of jobs.
 
It's easier to see these companies more in line with a stand-alone Custom Shop.  And like most very-specialized products, you're dealing with a small clientele who are nerds/techies for this particular thing.  And like anything else, the further you move away from the mass market, the buy-in gets steeper just as does the depreciation.
 
You see this is all markets.  You sell one Bosendorfer for every 500 Baldwins.  You move lots of point and shoots for a handful of Leicas.
Way more Sentras than GTR's.  And in most cases, they depreciate:  Look at a one year old Lexus 460, low miles, and you'l wonder how did it lose 30 grand that fast ?!?!
 
And you throw a used Series One on the wall at Guitar Center, then try and explain to Beavis or Butthead about the filters, the power supply, the five-pin cable . . . after the room quits spinning, they want a Schecter or an Ibanez or a Fender.  So it's a small market, and a store will pitch it fast and cheap to move it.
 
As you so correctly pointed out, anything is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it.  Vintage guitars are their own scene, but as I always wonder myself every time I wander through George Gruhn's, why anyone would pay that kind of money for these things is beyond me.
 
I'm long past that wonderment stage:  They're tools.  I do like them to look nice and play well.  Fender is easily making the best axes they've ever made, and the Custom Shop pieces can be exceptionally fine, if you're into Fenders.  There's lots of Fender-ish choices as well.  In every possible permutation imaginable.  Would not pay that kind of cash for an old bass, but that's just me.
 
The great thing, they screw together.  Just like being back in shop class! I'm gonna build me a Warmoth one of these days just like I'd want.  Probably depreciate fast . . . .
 
J o e y

glocke

  • club
  • Senior Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1258
Old basses being sold for silly money
« Reply #13 on: March 29, 2011, 03:37:05 AM »
I had a teacher years ago that got me into the vintage fender thing.  He was a pro who had literally a room full of vintage jazz and P basses.  
 
I eventually bought a beat up 72 sunburst  jazz bass and a 64 lake placid blue jazz bass from him.  The 72 was my primary bass for a long time, it played great, sounded ok.  
 
The 64 I only played  once in awhile, it played great and sounds fantastic.  The 64 plays and sounds like no other bass.  I've tried lots of the newer jazz basses being made these days and nothing comes close.  
 
I do think there is something about some of these old instruments.  It is not craftsmanship as they were (and are) basically mass produced pieces of wood screwed together.  Some people say that they older instruments have unique tonal qualities because of the woods that were used, old growth woods vs new growth woods.  Who knows.
 
I recently sold the 72, but still have the 64.  I'll be holding onto that bass as long as possible.
 
As far as pricing goes, something is really only worth as much as someone will pay for it.  Personally, Id never drop that much coin on a jazz or P bass ...

georgie_boy

  • club
  • Senior Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1115
Old basses being sold for silly money
« Reply #14 on: March 29, 2011, 04:05:52 AM »
I've got a 1975 Precision and to be honest it is just wonderful!
I set it up myself, and it plays and sounds like a dream-----Our own White-Cloud has played it and heard it in a live situation.
What I'm trying to say is, that next to my 76 Series 1, it is my preferred bass, simply because of that wonderful Precision bark. On full treble, it sounds identical to the Stranglers bass. I would have gladly paid three times the amout I paid for it. So--It all boils down to the buyer!-What's it worh to them??
 
George
 
(Message edited by georgie_boy on March 29, 2011)