...about to join the club, a little advice?

[moonkeyhead]

Hi folks,  
 
I've been working towards an Alembic for awhile now (Further). I've got everything sorted out money-wise, and intend to close the deal Monday. I live in San Francisco and have my eyes on the Further currently in stock at Showcase in San Jose. I've bugged the hell out of the guys down there, testing it, asking questions, etc. BUT, I am also eyeing the Further currently listed at Bass Central. So, my question is, has anyone on this forum had their hands on that guitar by any chance? I'm not too worried about ordering long distance, but then again I KNOW I like the one in San Jose. I'm giving the Bass Central guitar consideration because it will be cheaper state to state (no tax), and it has brass knobs. The latter is a small consideration, but still....
Also, I'm assuming some on this forum have purchased from Bass Central...a good experience?  
 
Though I know it is a long way off, I'd love to come to the next Bay Area Alembic gathering!

[David Houck]

Hi Jay; I just wanted to welcome you to the board!  For reports on past experiences, you might want to try the search feature in the upper right corner of this page.

[adriaan]

Or actually try this Google search - probably faster.

[moonkeyhead]

Thanks for the suggestion. I'll see what I can come up with.

[bsee]

Jay,  
 
Here's the short version:  
 
A lot of people have purchased from Bass Central, which stands to reason since they stock quite a few Alembics.  I am one.  I have never heard a complaint of any kind about Beaver and his crew.
 
Showcase is a great shop.  Though I live at the opposite end of the country, I make it a point to go there any time I am in the Bay area with a few hours to spare.  Doc Greene, known on these boards as Alembic_doctor is the Pro Audio manager over there.  Though prices are pretty firm, there may be other things that Showcase can do to make the deals more even.  It's always good to have a friendly relationship with the local shop.
 
When buying any guitar, I believe it's always best to have a hands-on experience before purchase.  When you're talking about hand-made instruments, the feel and tone may be subtly different from guitar to guitar.  You'll have to weigh the difference in overall cost against the risk that you don't like the other guitar as much, or that there is a mishap during shipping.
 
Good luck!
-bob

[moonkeyhead]

I'm thinking you are right, Bob. I bought a Les Paul long distance a few years ago, and it just plain had to go back (lots of little problems). Thankfully the return policy was agreeable. Though I trust the high quality of Alembic's output, I'm thinking more and more that a few hundred dollars and brass knobs are not worth buying something I haven't laid my hands on. The Les Paul experience made me cautious.  
 
I might add as well, that Showcase has a Tribute in stock, and it is actually a little cheaper than the Further (No LEDs, no continuous wood backplates - neither is a huge issue for me); I've not played it, though I have played the Further, but it has struck me that I should compare and contrast as I just might like the Tribute better for all I know. I'm going down Monday to play them both. But, yes, I think the guitar will come from Showcase in the end. I'm notoriously slow on decisions these days, but I'm prepared to walk away with one, so long as everything feels, right.  
 
Incidentally, like many here I was drawn to Alembic because of the Dead connection. I finally decided to go for one based on the quality of the instruments, their versatility, and frankly it feels good to give my money to someone other than a corporation.

[lbpesq]

Jay:
 
If the Tribute is the same one Doc brought up to the Alembic Gathering a couple of weeks ago, it is VERY pretty and plays VERY nicely.  You can completely trust Doc to give you good advice and info.  One thing you may not consider is the utility of the side LEDs.  When I ordered my custom Further (Woody - Oct. '07 COTM), I wasn't sure about the LEDs and thought them a little gimmicky, perhaps.  I posted a query on this forum and was overwhelmed with the positive things people said about LEDs.  That convinced me to order them.  Am I glad I did.  The LEDs are wonderful on dark stages.  Also, I can sing and see the frets with peripheral vision without my glasses.  Good luck and congrats.  I suspect you will be very satisfied no matter which decision you make.
 
Bill, the guitar one

[moonkeyhead]

Thanks Bill, I confess the LEDs do feel a bit gimmicky to, but not to any extreme extent, and the truth is I've kinda' pictured clicking them on in my practice space, lights out, all moody and whatnot. Heh.  
 
Anyway, funny about that Tribute, because I saw the pictures with the guy jamming with the tag still on it, and I thought, Hmmm, I wonder if somebody bought that Showcase Alembic? The tag being in their style.  
 
Well, I've got cash in pocket and am headed down Monday. I'm gonna put 'em through the paces. I'll admit too that I've been listening to Wolf-era Jerry, wherein are found some of my favorite shows and tones - I really like his sound on The Closing of Winterland.  
 
I'm getting excited. I really appreciate all the posts by the way! I'll keep you up to date on what happens.

[lbpesq]

Jay:
 
Other possible considerations:  The Further is a neck through.  The Tribute is a set neck.  Continuous wood backplates are not just very cool looking.  They are actually functional as the brass plates they replace are quite a bit heavier.  Alembics tend to be on the heavy side and wooden backplates help to alleviate weight.  All this may go out the window, of course, once you get your hands on the instruments.  When I bought my Gibson ES335 back in the '80s, I visited almost every music store in the Bay Area and played over a dozen used ES 335s and 345s.  One of them just felt right, as soon as I played it I knew it was the one - that's the one I bought ... for $400!  (In some ways I really miss those times!  lol)
 
Bill, tgo

[moonkeyhead]

Yeah, I have been thinking on the neck issue, and weight is something to consider as well. I know my preference at this point, but I've set myself to go in and just play and listen to them both, and start from there. When I bought my Les Paul (the one I still have) I had a color in mind, and a neck profile (they come in 50s - fat - or 60s - slim). I played a ton of guitars, and in the end went with a 50s neck in lightburst...but I'd set out to get a cherry burst with a 60s neck. So, I have an idea when I go in, but I'm willing to let the actual experience of playing and tone sway me on my final choice. I prefer the further from the aesthitic standpoint, but don't dislike the Tribute. If the Tribute blows the Further out of the water on feel and sound though, that'll be the one. If the differences are slight to my feel and ear, then I'll opt for the Further. They are very close to evenly priced - a matter of a couple hundred dollars.  
 
Also, both are 2006 prices, so I feel like I'm ahead of the curve so far as that goes.

[lbpesq]

Jay:
 
I can assure you that nothing blows an Alembic out of the water ... even another Alembic.
 
Bill, tgo

[bsee]

Jay, it's probably already in your head as a guy who has been around, but be careful of what sort of amp you listen to these guitars through.  If there's any tonal difference between them that matters to you, it might be covered up by an amp that has too much of its own voice.  Ideally, I'd try them through a few rigs.  In old-time terms, I'd go for a JC-120, a Fender Twin, and a Boogie.  Of course, if you're more into one particular tone and style, go there and be happy.  Nothing beats trying a guitar through the gear you'll actually play it through, and you might even bring your current favorite guitar to A-B with the Alembics in real time.  
 
As much as I believe that Alembic is the absolute best, it may be that neither of these is perfect for you.  When you're spending new money on an Alembic, it pays to get it right the first time.  You may find something missing in the tone that a little discussion will help you get on a new order for a few hundred more.  Maybe you wish the neck was thinner/fatter/wider/narrower?  A small price to pay for getting it just right.  What's a couple hundred when you're heading in the direction of $6-8K to begin with?
 
If one of these two sings for you, then jump on it.  If not, take a look at what it would take to make whatever little tweaks might bring you to the promised land.  You're also in an Alembic-rich area.  You might take a run up to Alembic to see if they have anything lying about the factory or try to get together with some of the locals to try some more instruments.  I know that playing a few other customs really helped me when I decided to take the plunge.  
 
I do have to disagree with Bill on one point.  I think an Alembic that fits you perfectly, particularly in neck dimensions, does blow any other Alembic out of the water.  If the standard shape and size is what fits you, then you're all set.  
 
Just my opinion...
 
-bob

[moonkeyhead]

Bob, I really like the sane advice here, very much so. I will test on multiple rigs. I'm really weighing my options as the weekend progresses. I've reminded myself that if I walk out with nothing, I still have the cash on hand to move when the right guitar presents itself. A trip to the factory might be nice for instance. I've kind of been thinking it would be nice to find a Further without an effects loop...and it has dawned on me that I could have one made.
 
I feel like it is very possible that I'll have a new guitar Monday, but I have all the patience in the world to wait if I feel like those particular guiars are not working for me.  
 
I sure appreciate all the sage posts here.

[lbpesq]

Jay:
 
I had my Further built without an effects loop.  Since I always play with volume at 10 and put a volume pedal at the end of my effects chain (essentially simulates the Garcia effects-always-see-the-same-signal) I had no use for the effects loop.  Bob's suggestion about trying different amps is an excellent one.  I've found some very good amps and guitars that just don't seem to like each other.  On the other hand, I still disagree with him about aquatic pyrotechnics.  One particular Alembic may be the right one for you, but all the others can still hold their own.  One caveat about ordering a custom:  it is a wonderful experience, but be sure to spend a lot of time really figuring out what you want as it is an awfully expensive proposition to not get it right the first time.  Many around here have suggested picking up a used lower end Alembic and living with it for a while to really crystallize your vision for a custom.  Also, you are going to wait.  The more customizing, the longer the wait, especially for inlays.  By the way, if you want to try out a Further without an effects loop, my studio is a hop, skip, and jump off of the Bay Bridge.  Have a blast on Monday, and don't be afraid to take your time.  As Paul, the bad one, (a regular around these parts) often reminds us: There will always be another.
 
Bill, tgo

[cozmik_cowboy]

Hey, Bill, how do you run the effects with your Series guitars?  Something like Irv>DS-5>effects>Boogie?
 
Peter