Author Topic: Ebay horror story still in progress  (Read 683 times)

57basstra

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Ebay horror story still in progress
« on: September 26, 2005, 07:26:15 AM »
This is hard to write, hard to admit. I see why some victims have a difficult time coming forward. I do not want the same thing to happen to any of y'all, so here goes... I was the winning bidder on the 1976 Series I on ebay about two months ago. My local postmaster sold me U.S. Money Orders. The Canadian Seller kept saying she could not cash them in Candada, and was sending them back. They never arrived. Finally another postmaster told me how to track them out. Yes, they had been cashed. It looks like I am out the $2,175 I paid for the bass on ebay (plus shipping). Serial number is 76 569 If anyone sees this again please avoid. The seller was blue6knight and is now no longer a registered ebay user. The thread posting is here on the Seen On Ebay and other sites and is archived through July 24, 2005. My gut told me to avoid this, but the deal was enticing, and, alas, too good to be true. This has been a total nightmare. The ebay number is #7337578013. I have opened a claim with ebay, but it looks like I'll only get back about $200 from them, if I am found to be in the right.  Apparently there is no way to directly talk with anyone on ebay about this. If anyone has a direct email site to communicate with a human at ebay, I would appreciate it. I waited before posting this because I am working with local law enforcement and we are working to involve the FBI and U.S. Postal Service in prosecuting this matter. Since it is a Candadian seller, this will be more difficult. The seller is claiming that someone else besides her cashed the money orders. If anyone has any ideas, please share them with me. Also, beware....any high end purchaser of any item on ebay is pretty much in peril, it seems. Thanks......as a side note, I had hoped to add a four string Alembic bass to the 5 string MK and 6 string Epic that I own. Guess that will wait as it is tough for me to overcome this type of financial loss. However, my situation does seem petty as compared to what some other folks are going through. If you shop on ebay....Buyer Beware! Please help me spread this message.

smichaels

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Ebay horror story still in progress
« Reply #1 on: September 26, 2005, 07:52:09 AM »
This is one of the problems with ebay (and paypal)...the vulnerability of the buyer. Sellers get ripped off too, but it is usually the buyer. I read somewhere that in the future, ebay is going to provide a service (for a fee, I am sure) that would essentially be fraud insurance.  
 
Is the seller helping out on the Canadian side of this? or is she obviously not shooting straight?
 
I hope things turn out good for you!
 
Sean

57basstra

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Ebay horror story still in progress
« Reply #2 on: September 26, 2005, 09:17:49 AM »
At this point, she is not helping. To make matters more complicated, I just swapped job assignments with my company to another nearby city.

tubeperson

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Ebay horror story still in progress
« Reply #3 on: September 26, 2005, 09:54:56 AM »
I'd like to offer some suggestions that may reduce your future risk in these types of transactions.  I was the lucky one who got the opportunity to purchase the Roman Conqueror.  Believe it or not, some scummy criminal sent me a second chance offer, after I had received the bass!  Since I was contacted originally by a second chance offer, through E-bay My Message, this is what I did, to confirm that the seller was legitimate. Again it's not perfect, but at least some prudent steps may ward off a crook:
 
I first confirmed with the seller that the second chance offer was legitimate.  Since he was using a service to sell his instrument, I contacted the service directly as well. The seller did confirm that the second chance offer was legitimate, and we have struck up a cordial e-mail friendship.  After buzzing with the seller, I then contacted the vendor, and asked for a phone number.  I confirmed that the phone number was legitimate, and the vendor's address for the seller was also legitimate.  I spoke with them directly, and again have developed a good relationship with them.  It should be mentioned that E-bay sends legitimate second chance offers only through your My E-Bay section.  I also researched the vendor independently to confirm his address and phone number, to further assure myself that these people seemd to be legit, which they are to this day.  If you receive a second chance offer directly with you regular e-mail and not via the My message in E-bay, the chances are that it would be a bogus offer.
 
My heartfelt wishes for justice go out to this fellow club member, it is here that I feel E-bay is shielded because of the industry they are in.  If the auto or Pharmeceutical industry got away with what e-commerce and software vendors did, we'd have to walk everywhere and eat natual products to heal (love tha voodoo an aloe vera).
We need to somehow come up with a mechanism to better protect the innocent well-intentioned members of the on-line community.  Maybe E-bay needs to take a case on the chin via the courts because if they did, you can rest assured they would spend more resources cleaning up the crap.  I have been the intended victim of credit card fraud, but thank my lucky stars and the higher power that the credit card company checked on whether I was purchasing a large amount of jewelry in another city from where I lived.  I even had my credit card with me at home at the time of purchase/fraud, but somehow the criminals got access to my number!
 
Bottom line, know your vendor, and if they do not give you a verifiable address, phone and fax, I would be very wary. If is sounds too good to be true, it probably is.
 
Just thought I'd offer some thoughts to try to protect us.
 
Now let's get back to Feral fenders and Scary Alembics!  And good luck/condolences to Mica.  I hope she finds peace, as we all learn to deal with the cycle of life.

57basstra

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Ebay horror story still in progress
« Reply #4 on: September 26, 2005, 10:06:19 AM »
Seller gave me a valid phone number, address, and email. We communicated through all three. We also communicated via ebay. The second chance offer I accepted was through ebay. My real problem was in trusting the ebay process. I don't know if the person is running, or has been suspended by ebay because I cannot now leave a negative feedback because she is not a registered user. It should not be this easy to steal someones' money.

57basstra

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Ebay horror story still in progress
« Reply #5 on: September 26, 2005, 10:10:55 AM »
Again....this second chance offer was through EBAY. and is documented as such....Ebay has opened a claim that it is investigating as one of its transacitons......It was not one of the dozens and dozens of scam second chance offers I've received via regular email that say EBAY.....

tubeperson

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Ebay horror story still in progress
« Reply #6 on: September 26, 2005, 10:34:06 AM »
And that is exactly why E-bay has some culpability in this.  Here the buyer does whatever he can do protect himself through the E-bay process, and still gets screwed.  No other legitimate business could get away with this.  I'm on the buyer's side based on the information presented here.  I've said in a previous post that E-bay gets to hide it's head in the sand and Dave Houch chastised me for making that statement.  What is one supposed to say now? Caveat Emptor!

effclef

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Ebay horror story still in progress
« Reply #7 on: September 26, 2005, 01:22:43 PM »
David, you may have to wait 3 months until you can ask for it, but the USPS can give you a copy of the Money Orders, front and back, which should at least show someone's signature.  
 
EffClef

57basstra

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Ebay horror story still in progress
« Reply #8 on: September 26, 2005, 02:44:44 PM »
We are already that far. I have one of the three copies of cashed money order with others coming from USPS. I do have some good contacts in law enforcement beyond the local level. We are documenting, but the process takes time. Once I have the other two money order copies, I then file a request to have USPS look at the signatures and check their info to see where they were cashed, what post office. If they were cashed in the US by a CAnadian citizen, someone had to use a passport. As you can see, there are numerous potential criminal acts. This will not go away easily for this ebay seller, who had a 97 percent favorable rating.

lothartu

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Ebay horror story still in progress
« Reply #9 on: September 26, 2005, 03:18:21 PM »
who had a 97 percent favorable rating
 
I would bet that the seller's other favorable trasactions were with alter-egos of himself/herself on other accounts.  If you can still get into the ebay member history you might see if the other accounts that had trasactions with the seller account are maybe still open.  This scammer may not have been smart enough to clean up behind themselves.
 
As a side note, I only have a little experience with Ebay from both a buying and selling standpoint and I know paypal isn't perfect but I've never bought or sold an item though ebay where a money order or cash was ever an acceptable payment option.  It always made me too nervous when I was the buyer and I never liked how it looked when I was the seller.
 
If and when I ever purchase an item in excess of $500 I think I'll bite the bullet and pay for an escrow service to handle the transaction.  Not because I think an escrow service is a perfect solution but because anyone that's trying to scam isn't going to go through all the trouble of agreeing to an escrow service intermediary.  It's too much trouble and hassle for the scammer.  Anyone who is legit should be happy to agree to the process as long as the buyer foots the escrow bill.
 
- Jim

drjenney

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Ebay horror story still in progress
« Reply #10 on: September 26, 2005, 03:46:19 PM »
Jim,
 
Just a cautionary note about escrow services: they are not all created equal.  We had a situation during this last year [on this list, I believe] where the seller listed some unknown escrow service in Romania. It was bogus!  
 
Personally, I would fly to pick up my bass with cash in hand. BassGear.com has some real horror stories to tell. Failing the cash, face-to-face transaction, be sure to use PayPal, a US escrow company listed with the BBB or some other really secure method.
 
I've had over 100 transactions on eBay with only 1 problem, but I always use PayPal.
 
Dr. J

phys49

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Ebay horror story still in progress
« Reply #11 on: September 26, 2005, 08:31:12 PM »
David,
Since the fraud involved USPS money orders it should be possible to get USPS postal inspecters involved. They do have some resources not readily available to most law enforcement agencies.
I have about 50 Ebay transactions as buyer and seller with no problems. I do insist on using Paypal or have a face to face meeting with the buyer/seller.
I hope you are able to recover your money.
Best wishes,
Perry

David Houck

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Ebay horror story still in progress
« Reply #12 on: September 27, 2005, 07:30:22 AM »
David; I'm sorry to hear of your misfortune.  Please keep us posted on the progress of your investigation.

57basstra

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Ebay horror story still in progress
« Reply #13 on: September 27, 2005, 12:09:28 PM »
Thanks Guys. The support is great and very comforting. If anyone knows anything about the bass in question, for sure let us know, ie., if it is owned by someone else other than my Canadian 'seller' ...for whom I would supply identification , if needed. I wanted to post this in part to make sure it did not show up again..and I mean EVER EVER show up again I know the folks at this forum would spot it immediately. Thanks!

lbpesq

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Ebay horror story still in progress
« Reply #14 on: September 27, 2005, 02:16:45 PM »
David:
 
I found your post very sobering as I am about to bid on a guitar where the seller doesn't take paypal.  The feedback looks good and I've spoken with the seller by telephone.  Based on your experience, I've decided if I win I'm sending the postal money order registered mail, return receipt requested so I'll be able to prove the seller received it sould a problem develop.  I hope you wind up getting your bass or $ back.
 
Thanks,  Bill, tgo