Another !0 percent ...

[5stringho]

Another 10%. Guess we'll just have to save a little more or play a few more gigs. It took me over a year to pay for my Excel 5, but I don't regret it for a minute or a dollar of it. I think I've dropped my sights a little  from a Series 1 or 2 to a MK or Stanley Standard, and it may take me 2-3 years and selling some of my other Basses to get one, but eventually, I'll get what I want. If you quit smoking or cut back on the alcohol (or other libations!) it's AMAZING how much money you can put back!!! Good luck, gentlemen!!   Mike

[honkylips]

After pondering this 10% increase for a few days, I've stumbled onto a solution.  Alembic needs to outsource the manufacturing of these things to China or Taiwan, somewhere with dirt-cheap labor costs.  They can slap the same old Alembic logo on the headstock and sell them at a more reasonable cost.  In fact, if I did my math right it appears they may be able to lower prices a bit.  That way we can all buy several Alembics.  Because really, who can get by with just one?  
 
C'mon people.  Be happy that Alembic hasn't made build costs and pricing their number one priority. They have always been an elite instrument (and never at a bargain price), and I hope that in my lifetime they stay that way.  Kudos to Alembic for doing whatever they need to do to keep quality the top priority.

[jsaylor]

Its inflation...and personal greed. Don't take greed too harshly, because it's simple, they want more money for their products. If you don't like the prices, simply don't purchase from Alembic anymore. If enough people don't buy from them, Alembic will be forced to reduce prices. Thats how capitalism works. Supply and demand.
 
(Message edited by jsaylor on December 19, 2006)

[David Houck]

Jordan wrote, if enough people don't buy from them, Alembic will be forced to reduce prices. Thats how capitalism works. Supply and demand.
 
I don't think that is necessarily the only outcome.
 
For instance one of the businesses that I work with hasn't been getting enough sales in its particular market.  So last month the owners sold the business.  In this particular case it made more economic sense to sell the business than to lower prices.
 
Sometimes business owners elect, as Craig humorously alluded to, and as many people in the American Midwest have experienced, to cut costs by moving their operations to areas with lower labor and/or materials costs.  Some layoff workers and reduce output.  Some try to maintain margins by cutting quality.  And of course some owners find themselves in a position where it's in their best interest to just shut the doors and retire.
 
Another option for some companies that want to retain their employees and maintain their level of quality is to change their product mix; if demand for a certain product is reduced, they may retrain their employees and start making a different product for which demand is rising.
 
Labor costs are not always a directly variable cost in the same way that materials often are.  Some labor costs are indirect and some are not variable.  Thus a company may have a reduction in sales but it might not necessarily be able to reduce its labor costs.  Supply and demand isn't always as simple as one might expect.  Sometimes lowering prices isn't the best choice for a business owner; sometimes it's not even a viable choice.
 
And by the same token, for a particular business, given its fixed and variable costs and its direct and indirect costs, sometimes increasing supply isn't the best choice either.  Often there is a point where a small increase in production will require a significant increase in labor costs, resulting in a higher per unit cost.
 
So no, it is not always necessarily the case that a reduction in demand will result only in a reduction in prices.  A reduction in demand can result in a reduction in supply.  And a reduction in supply can result in .. higher prices.
 
Now I am not suggesting any of the above pertains to any particular business in Santa Rosa.  I'm only addressing Jordan's general statement that reduced demand will force a reduction in prices.  That wasn't what I was taught in business school and it hasn't been my experience in dealing with my clients and it hasn't been my observation of the business world in general.  However, it may indeed be the case that in Jordan's experience, in businesses that he may be involved in, reduced demand has always resulted in reduced prices; and given such an experience it would be understandable that one might conclude that such a correlation might pertain to all businesses in general.  But I just don't think it's an accurate assumption.

[bigredbass]

I was doing adjustments on my ALEMBIC the other day.  I had the back off, playing with the trim pots to fine tune the mix of the new FATBOYS I recently updated into the BigRedBass.
 
Let's see:  They made the pickups.  In the cavity were not just pots, but pots with little PC boards and who knows what else, all with ALEMBIC part numbers.  Custom made plug-in leads for the FATBOYS.  No foil, silver paint.  No wood screws, machine screws with inserts.  Put the back cover back on, turned the bass over.  They fabricated the tailpiece, the bridge, the adjustable nut.  FIRST-class wood and wood working and finish.
 
In other words, they fabricated most everything on this axe.  Aside from raw wood, basic electronic parts and wire, they fabricated (and in some cases, invented) most everything I was looking at.  OK, the keys were off-the-shelf Gotoh (save for the engraved A's which I'm sure Gotoh does at assembly).  And I'm sure there is not another SPOILER exactly like mine.  I'm sure there's only a small percentage of their output where the wood/finish/electronic build recipe would qaulify as a 'production run'.  Otherwise, they're all one-offs in detail.  This is NOT cheap.
 
I could line up any number of supposedly competitive, handbuilt basses, and while their woodworking may be proprietarily unique, how many of them have off-the-shelf electronics and the bulk of their small parts list (knobs, nuts, bridges, etc.) all came from StewMac or AllParts?
 
In fact, remove the Barts/EMGs and their accompanying circuits, then the Gotoh or HipShot bridges, keys, etc, and you're left with just the woodwork.  This is just fine, but it's just NOT the sophisticated level of build that you get by building virtually everything under the same roof to a common esthetic.  Plus, NOBODY has Ron's ears.
 
They've never been cheap, they never will be cheap, because you can't do this on the cheap.  
There are other axes, but there is no other ALEMBIC.
 
J o e y

[the_8_string_king]

It's NOT greed Jordan.  Not that greed, in and of itself, is a bad thing (although many people who have postured as philosophers have by and large succeeded in getting people to accept the package deal that greed involves screwing other people inherently... but that's a separate issue).
 
I've been out to the factory, and personally met and talked to the fine folks at Alembic.  As far as can be ascertained, they live a fairly modest existence.  I see the reason for the price increase as simply being costs they have to pay themselves, and therefore must pass on to their customers.  This isn't any fun... but it's reality.  Other members have already pointed out that Alembic is located in one of the costliest areas of the country to live in.  Frankly, I'd never consider living in California because of the ridiculously mismanaged government of the state; but again, that's a separate issue.  They DO choose to live there... and they have to deal with the government and taxes, and reality.
 
It sucks.  But I don't think they're raising the price for any other reason than they deem it necessary to meet their obligations/requirements of survival/maintaining their existence.
 
It DOES suck, to be sure.  But, as far as I'm concerned, they're doing what they need to do.
 
Alembics have alway been expensive.  But... it's all relative.  In my opinion, they are a bargain, because -expensive though they be- what you get for you're money FAR surpasses other available options/alternatives.
 
I've played a lot of nice basses.  But I can honestly tell you, right now, that if, somehow, a rich stranger decided to buy me 3 basses... they'd all be Alembics.  Because they're the best.  Because nothing else comes close.
 
I had to save for QUITE some time to buy my first stock Alembic; then, when I decided to buy my second/1st custom, I had to save even longer... and it took me several years to pay off.
 
I don't regret it.  Because it was worth it.  In fact, I recently found out they actually LOST money on my custom (which I feel bad about).  In fact, they actually threw in a couple VERY NICE extras to placate me over delays in construction -which were due to them underestimating the costs of the very elaborate features of my custom.  At one point Susan had offered to give me a superfilter to placate me.  I'm sure glad I didn't accept.  I had some intuitive sense that they were doing the best they could; and -considering they lost money on my bass- I'd feel like a real heel if these people has lost even MORE money on me.  I really want them to make some money on me with my next/current custom... because they deserve it.
 
I KNOW from my own experience that priority number #1 for Alembic is to make their customers the best instruments possible for their customers WITHOUT COMPROMISE.  Period.  We had some heated moments during the construction of my 1st custom (due to MY impatience, justified or not).  At no point did money enter into their equation.  They placed the highest value on customer satisfaction.  They showed this in their actions.  They never SAID it; they didn't need to.  They SHOWED it... in everything they did.  They built me the best bass possible for the quoted price (FAR MORE, to be sure).
 
This is NOT the same as getting people the lowest possible price.  It just isn't.
 
There is ABSOLUTELY NO DOUBT in my mind that they are raising prices for only one reason: they need to... to maintain their standards, and to meet their needs.
 
Yes, it sucks... it really does.  I wish they didn't have to raise their prices.  I wish I could have afforded to get the extended fingerboard I wanted WITHOUT sacrificing other options; I wish I could have got gold hardware; I wish I could have got a Series instrument; I wish I could have got custom electronics.  I really do.
 
I also wish everyone was honest and rational, and that there was world peace, and our cats had wings and could do the dishes.
 
But reality ain't so.
 
I know that I'll be getting the best instrument money can buy -for my next custom.  Even though they haven't even built it yet, I can see it like it's in front of me... I have total confidence.
 
And it'll take me a while to pay off, in all likelyhood.
 
But, expensive though it be, it WILL be worth it.  I'll confirm this in several months when I get the bass.
 
Are Alembics expensive?  Sure.  Always have been.  Most likely, always will be.  I don't see any way they could do what they do, otherwise.
 
But really, for what you get they're a bargain...
 
ALEMBIC AREN'T EXPENSIVE... they're PRICELESS!!!
 
Mark/the 8 String King

[dannobasso]

Ah the magical lure of the Alembic!I called today about an inlay question. As always, the relationship and concern for customers is first and foremost. (even for those who are a complete pain in the lower lumbar region) As my delightful conversation with Mica came to a close, the seed was planted. An hour or so later I emailed her with an idea for a lined fretless Excel 5, ebony board, rouge guts, bridgeblock, red led's and black finish. She stayed late and sent me back a price. I'm going for it! December special baby! Led's!  
It's not an ultra custom series but I know that it will be an exceptional piece. (also good that I'm selling off a thunderbird and a 4003 to defray the cost!)  
End result is these amazing artisans have my continued and full support.  
(btwAnyone want a Dean brian bromberg B2 5 or Ripper for a good price? )

[bob]

Oh dear, Jordan, you seem to have stuck your foot in your mouth yet again.
 
Fortunately, people here seem to be quite patient and even encouraging with you. To your credit, I believe that is largely because you have shown yourself to be open-minded, willing to consider new ideas, and even change your opinion.
 
Dave covered the economics lesson much better than I could have, so I'll take a stab at the other piece.
 
You said, it's personal greed...they want more money for their products.
 
You stated this as fact, but I would politely suggest it is nothing more than uninformed speculation on your part (politely, si?).
 
For instance, have you:
- Visited Alembic in person several times?
- Had lengthy, and often personal, phone conversations with Mica, Susan, Mary, Val, etc.?
- Had a long history of experience with their instruments, including most importantly the process of building a custom to your specifications, over the course of 18 months or so?
 
I don't want to make too big a deal about it, but like Mark, I also know that Alembic lost money on my custom, even though I ended up paying considerably more than they asked. (Hey, maybe the price increase is my fault!)
 
I have just a very simple suggestion to make. Perhaps the next time you make a statement like this, you might preface it with something like I think maybe.... You are certainly entitled to your opinion and conjecture, but unless you can back it up with hard facts - which I submit would be impossible in this case - it's usually better to play it safe and leave yourself an easy out.
 
As best I can tell, there is absolutely nothing in the world these people would prefer to do than to build fantastic instruments, and somehow keep together a dedicated (small) group of artisans to do so. I can believe they need to raise prices to do so, but I happen to strongly believe, based on knowing these people personally that it's about survival, not greed.
 
-Bob

[jsaylor]

Bob,
This is just something I have observed. I thought posting this it would be taken as a personal opinion, seeing as that makes the most sense. They raise their prices every year, at the same time. They might be giving themselves a raise, but also rightnow, we have the worse inflation we have had in years.
 
Mark,  
This isn't about how much you save up for a bass, rather how their increasing their already expensive prices. I do believe that this will reduce their sales. This little exclusive group on here might not care, and or effect their purchasing, but alot of other musicians won't take kindly to this issue, and might make them go to another company. Alembics aren't for everyone, although they are very nice instruments from a visual perspective (I have yet to play one). Some people I have talked to have owned some, but said their just not for them. The ones that like them it probably won't affect them.
 
Dave,
Supply and demand is a core principal of our economy. I will use and example. Coats. During the summer there is a surplus of coats, and noone wants them, so the prices lower so the company can sell off existing stock.
 
Lets not start this into a quality issue. Alembics are high quality instruments, as are every boutique instrument maker.

[the_8_string_king]

Jordan, I don't have time right now to say anything other than this one thing, and then split for work.
 
I take issue with some of what you've said here and on other threads, and I can't go any further on it now.
 
But I would also like to say that I respect your maintaining a civilized demeanor while expressing your thoughts.  This is a virtue I must acknowledge -especially in light of some recent uncharacteristic nonsense on this site.
 
Peace, brother(s)!!!
 
P.S.  I also think you do a better-than-average job of presenting your thoughts in a simple/minimized, straightfoward way.  This is good because, logically/epistemologically, it gives you the razor to prove your point/advance your argument when/to the extent it's true/valid... and, conversely, it exposes the incorrect assumptions/errors when such are made.
 
This is also a virtue.
 
More later...

[adriaan]

Jordan,
 
You can't really blame Alembic for raising their prices, and in the same breath complain about inflation. Inflation means that prices are going up because the value of the currency is going down - not the other way around.

[olieoliver]

Jordan, I agree with you on one point, Alembics aren't for everyone.., this statement is very true.
 
I disagree on another statement though, Alembics are high quality instruments, as are every boutique instrument maker. Not all boutique instrument makers are high quality. I will not name drop but I have played poor quality boutique instruments.

[apdavis]

Mark,
You would wish for cats with wings?  My cats are enough trouble already,  wing equipped cats would take it to a completely different level!

[811952]

I believe (and may well be way off base here) that initially the Distillate and other non-series models which followed after were built to satisfy a shifting demand in the market.  Series basses were still the cat's 455, but other builders (B.C. Rich, etcetera) were using active electronics and filling the gap (somewhat) between Series instruments and Fender/Gibson/etcetera old technology instruments.  The Spoiler sold for something like $1200 or $1300 in '82, the Distillate for something like $1800 and a Series bass was something on the order of $3500 for a *basic* 4 string.  Note that the most recent (I think) new Alembic bass, the Excel, is also the least expensive model.  I think we'll see more of this sort of thing if the economy continues to tighten.  
 
 
John

[jsaylor]

Olie,
Boutique Means high-quality and elegant. If it wasn't high quality, then it wouldn't be boutique. I'm not refering to any small shop, because smaller shops like Wish bass have been rated quite poorly, while others are extremely high quality such as Conklin, Ken Lawrence, Alembic, Carl Tompson, Ritter and countless others. Even some newer guys can make good basses. Look at Jean Baudins Hidious Claw(I love that bass), that was mainly made by a guy who is just geting started. Now I know this is a rather biast forum, but you can't argue that no other companys are as high quality as Alembic, because thats a matter of opinion. Thats where I though you were going.  
 
 
Adriaan,
Yes, inflation is caused by increasing prices lowering the value of the currency. We (america) are experiancing the worse inflation we have had in years. Luckly, Alembic isn't in Europe, because the current exchange rate is $1 EUR to $2 USD.