Author Topic: I Dont See The Point......  (Read 2213 times)

hb3

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Re: I Dont See The Point......
« Reply #75 on: July 25, 2010, 11:04:36 AM »
And Bill Evans supposedly wrote a lot more of Kind of Blue than he got credit for.

David Houck

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Re: I Dont See The Point......
« Reply #76 on: July 25, 2010, 11:31:04 AM »
Hugh; another book I have is Kind of Blue, The Making of the Miles Dave Masterpiece by Ashley Kahn.  Great book about the making of the album; highly recommended if you're interested in how it all came about.  And I also have a Bill Evans bio and a Coltrane bio.  It was an amazing period in music history.

toma_hawk01

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Re: I Dont See The Point......
« Reply #77 on: July 25, 2010, 12:25:08 PM »
Hugh, the beauty of Miles Davis, he cultivated the majestic personality of being honest about his flaws and weaknesses, this is what made Miles Great.  
 
On the other hand...
This is what you get, when you are perfect...
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6BYd_aQD1Y
 
Morris Day, with a bass...  
 
...I was the best musician in the band, and could play better... play rings around anyone...
- Stanley Clarke  
 
I brought the bass out of the closet...
- Stanley Clarke
 
Well my bass keeps running under the bed..., do you think Mr. Clarke could help me with mine?
 
 
 
Peace and Love,
 
Hal-
 
 
 
(Message edited by toma_hawk01 on July 25, 2010)

hb3

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Re: I Dont See The Point......
« Reply #78 on: July 25, 2010, 01:05:01 PM »
Cool video. Thanks. He does come off as somewhat arrogant. I'm sort of in the middle on the Clarke vs. Davis thing.  
 
And if you haven't seen this, you must check it out:  
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ZhNQhl6qUQ

mike1762

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Re: I Dont See The Point......
« Reply #79 on: July 25, 2010, 04:44:54 PM »
It takes a degree of narcissism to ever go into the entertainment industry in the first place.  For those that venture outside of the Pop realm, your main motivation may be to feed your ego.  Take a guy like Gene Simmons: he can barely play his instrument (he's probably better than I think he is... maybe), but he knows that.  His motivation is to entertain as many people as possible and sell them CDs, lunch boxes, bobble-heads, etc.  Stanley Clarke, Miles Davis and other players of that ilk have a limited audience right out of the gate... so why do it?  It satisfies something deep within their psyche.  One of my favorite quotations is Edward Bulwer-Lytton: Talent does what it can; genius does what it must.  Those guys were/are genious, but they probably aren't great best friend material.

bigredbass

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Re: I Dont See The Point......
« Reply #80 on: July 25, 2010, 05:24:11 PM »
After being around more than a few famous musicians, I can only add this:  Basing any opinions on the random press, promotion, and incidental media exposure you may run across, as well as their released projects, is about the same as guessing what a movie actor is like in real life only by their movie roles.
 
I've never been impressed by the famous at a distance.  In some cases, once you know them, they can occasionally be fairly normal people.  That's usually not the case, as it's a highly irregular way to earn a living in a very different world than most of us can imagine.  The demands of that sort of talent on the rest of one's psyche often results in less than typical behavior in lots of cases.  Sadly, the music business is littered with tons of unfortunate stories, as well as some good ones occasionally of people who did stop short of the cliff, so to speak.
 
I long ago learned to enjoy a performance or a recording as one would admire a photograph:  A beautiful moment, preserved.  But that leaves a lot of time for a life that none of us know about.  I simply don't know anything about them as people, so I try not to go there, as I get a lot wrong looking in from the outside.  
 
J o e y

toma_hawk01

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Re: I Dont See The Point......
« Reply #81 on: July 25, 2010, 05:48:29 PM »
Like Stanley said...  
 
It's very commercial and when someone who is as talented as he believes he is, and also being someone who believes of being a Jazz purest too, (if that's true...) then I believe Stanley betrayed a whole market of Jazz listeners when he jumped into trying to sound like Grand Master Flash, and the Furious 5.  
 
From a competitive musical mind set (which is the contrary of my belief and musical values...)  I was better than anyone... would be challenged. As a result, neither Stanley, nor his band couldn't personally hold a candle to anything Grand Master Flash and the Furious 5 was kicking.  
 
That's what happens when you sound off and talk too much. Poetic Justice is a bit_h, and during that whole period, for all the things Stanley did with RTF, was forgotten and dismissed because Stanley maybe didn't know what he really had. (I am only speaking to the RTF band, when it's membership was of 4 people...)
 
What's funny in this history, I personally find amazing:
 
Two band would spring from Mile's legacy:
 
1. Weather Report - Bassist Jaco Pastorius
2. Return To Forever - Bassist Stanley Clarke
 
What legacy had Stanley created?
 
As for Miles love for Mr. John Francis Anthony Jaco Pastorius, Miles would leave this music in dedication... to Jaco
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2xez4_miles-davis-marcus-miller-jaco-past_music
 
As to what was left to Stanley, perhaps began when Stanley refused to accept joining Miles band, but instead join Chic's band. Perhaps, Stanley jinks himself on the refusal (I don't know...) But, I do know Miles was connected in the industry like Frank Sinatra. You just don't refuse a Miles Davis nor a Frank Sinatra and why in the hell would you do so anyway, when anybody and everybody who came from those institutions, became mega stars!  
 
But, in the end, with Stanley sounding off in ridicule on Miles Davis during Stanley's honorary PhD, even after knowing Miles was gracious enough to acknowledge and respect Stanley enough to  asked him to join his band, is a double whammy for me understanding the contrasting personalities of each celebrity, and to the realization (as to) who's music stands stronger through the winds of time? I have my answer., and it's pretty clear now.    
 
Who's who of Mile Davis, is the question.  
   
What legacy had Stanley created? (can anyone tell me)?
 
 
I believe Stanley thought he was Napoleon of music, to think he could just jump into any genera of music, and be accepted without being properly introduced, nor have a legacy to the game.  
 
Like I said, Stanley can't have it both ways, and of all the people who grown to love Stanley's music, was a complete let down of betrayal, for people who held on to his message in music, expected something more profound if they felt their tax dollars were contributed on his musical education.
 
During the mid-80's, I believe, Stanley should had taken a long vacation. Take time out to breath in the Sunshine, and a dip into the pool and enjoy the family and laugh with those he loves, and let the business bell ring, and come back when a need for quality would be back in fashion.
 
But, Stanley thought of the song...
 
She thought I was Grand Master Flash...
 
Thinking of Grand Master Flash...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ChjLMbXVrU
 
 
Peace and Love,
 
Hal-
 
 
(Message edited by toma_hawk01 on July 25, 2010)

David Houck

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Re: I Dont See The Point......
« Reply #82 on: July 25, 2010, 07:34:12 PM »
Hal; I sent an email to you a couple days ago.  Just checking to see if you received it.

serialnumber12

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Re: I Dont See The Point......
« Reply #83 on: July 25, 2010, 07:42:42 PM »
Brilliant!
keavin barnes @ facebook.com

serialnumber12

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Re: I Dont See The Point......
« Reply #84 on: July 25, 2010, 07:43:20 PM »
Brilliant!
keavin barnes @ facebook.com

toma_hawk01

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Re: I Dont See The Point......
« Reply #85 on: July 25, 2010, 08:58:40 PM »
Yes Dave, I read your email, more than once.
 
Please read my reply.  
 
Peace and Love,
 
Hal-
 
(Message edited by toma_hawk01 on July 25, 2010)

David Houck

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Re: I Dont See The Point......
« Reply #86 on: July 25, 2010, 10:36:50 PM »
Hal; I haven't received a reply.  Can you send it again?

toma_hawk01

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Re: I Dont See The Point......
« Reply #87 on: July 26, 2010, 01:09:53 AM »
Did I cross the line...? Am I disturbing anyone...with this? I hope no feelings are being hurt?  
 
Please let me know, and I will withdraw, and hold my thoughts from this forum from this point forward.  
 
For I come in peace, and I wish no harm at all... and I know, it get's hot in the kitchen...  I can open a window.
 
Peace and Love,
 
Hal-
 
 
(Message edited by toma_hawk01 on July 26, 2010)

hb3

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Re: I Dont See The Point......
« Reply #88 on: July 26, 2010, 06:14:22 AM »
Hal, I've agreed with much that you've said here, and I'm not troubled by it in the slightest. The only thing I'm wondering about is -- didn't you have some sort of blog on the SC board, and there was some conflict? So I wonder if you'd be expressing yourself differently if there hadn't been that trouble.

terryc

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Re: I Dont See The Point......
« Reply #89 on: July 26, 2010, 06:26:38 AM »
I guess it is difficult when the 'spotlight of the famous' shines on you..one wrong word and you are the devil incarnate.
I don't care what anyone says about anyone, it's their view whether it is right or wrong, I just want to know how the hell he played that set of notes!!!