Author Topic: Preamp/power amp question (Read 188 times)

redcloud · « **on:** December 12, 2011, 05:07:23 PM »

I have been contemplating the purchase of a Jule Amp Monique tube DI/EQ/preamp and decided that owning a decent power amp would be nice to have/ use whether or not I get the Monique. I ended up buying a QSC PLX2502, but I won't have it for a couple of weeks. I plan on using the power amp with either my Barefaced Big Twin or My Schroeder PL18.

Ignoring the fact that Alembic makes a nice preamp, has anyone used just a power amp with their Alembic basses?

I have 3 other very nice amps (Reeves Custom 400, Thunderfunk TFB800-B2, & a PJB Roadcase BG-800) that work well with my basses but am just curious if a preamp beyond what is on our basses is that essential when using a power amp into a quality bass cab.

Bradley Young · « **Reply #1 on:** December 12, 2011, 07:27:48 PM »

Jimmy Johnson has stated that he does that sometimes with his Series bass. The Series instruments put out enough voltage to drive a power amp; your mileage may vary on battery powered instruments.

JimmyJ · « **Reply #2 on:** December 12, 2011, 09:12:12 PM »

That's true, I do.

It's not for everybody but I like the sound of my Series basses flat through full range speakers. For instance, on the road in clubs I will plug straight into powered floor monitors if available, or even run a line to the power amp that is powering my wedge. I purposely have the onboard preamp trim pots set for high gain so I have this option.

If I am presented with a bass amp to play through I will first try using the effects return which usually bypasses the pre.

The result of running this way is a very clean sound - no additional preamp to add noise. However, you give up the tone controls and are relying on the sound of the speaker cab (and the bass controls) to give you the tone you want to hear. I have heard that there is no such thing as flat on a Fender preamp. The reason was the pre was designed to act in combination with the speakers that came with the amp. That's why my effects return method doesn't always work, sometimes you need the help of the preamp controls to make up for any peculiarities of the speaker.

When you get your power amp just experiment and see what you get, you may be surprised!

Jimmy J

bigredbass · « **Reply #3 on:** December 12, 2011, 10:32:50 PM »

Jimmy, do you think this came from playing thru headphone returns in studio recording (usually no bass amp), or/and the classic hi-fi approach of having as few items in the signal chain between source and power/speakers? Or both?

I wish my ears could wrap around that dry and accurate a tone . . . if only my ego and my technique could come to an understanding about all those finger/string noises !

J o e y

JimmyJ · « **Reply #4 on:** December 12, 2011, 11:34:19 PM »

J o e y, that's funny! Like I said, it's not everybody's cup of tea.

Yes the headphone thing may have been what got me started down this road. But the wide dynamics and immediacy of the straight-to-power-amp thing is a sound I really like.

Jimmy J

redcloud · « **Reply #5 on:** December 13, 2011, 04:21:48 AM »

Thanx, for the replies.

terryc · « **Reply #6 on:** December 13, 2011, 08:17:21 AM »

When I visited the factory 11 years ago I asked Ron about this option and his reply was exactly that 'plug your bass directly into a high quality power amp with just a gain control and a high quality speaker(s)'.
When my amp was 'offroad' and a gig came up I used a Peavey DSS700 digital power amp and a Hysys 500 PA cab just to get me through..okay it wasn't ultra high quality but just using the filters & Q switches it sounded pretty damn good to me and the rest of the band.

811952 · « **Reply #7 on:** December 13, 2011, 10:38:25 AM »

I gigged with no preamp for a few years (1600 watts into 18's and 10's, stereo and LOUD). The only issue was tuning the rig for the room in some instances. In general though the bass tone wasn't lacking anything and sounded great.

John

redcloud · « **Reply #8 on:** December 13, 2011, 10:38:56 AM »

I was aware that one can bypass an amps preamp with the effects loop and may do that for fun. To be honest, I really want the Monique and would either need a powered cab (and there aren't that many of those around newly made) or a power amp. Since I have the power amp ordered and will get it soon, I can try it out alone with my basses. I guess I was just looking for a way to use the power amp more often.

funkyjazzjunky · « **Reply #9 on:** December 13, 2011, 01:04:33 PM »

I wonder if Jimmy Johnson uses line level effects with that set-up?

VMG

JimmyJ · « **Reply #10 on:** December 14, 2011, 12:43:30 AM »

VMG,
I used to use a chorus on the bridge pickup for soloing but haven't done that in a while. When I do what I am describing above I don't use any effects. However ... the idea of a line-level effects rig opens up some interesting possibilities.....
Jimmy J

bigredbass · « **Reply #11 on:** December 14, 2011, 11:09:14 PM »

Jimmy, what's a way to evaluate power amps? By nature, they should all be realtively 'color-less' (and to borrow a JJ-ism . . . HAH!), but what can you suggest to look for, or listen for?

J o e y

JimmyJ · « **Reply #12 on:** December 15, 2011, 12:38:50 AM »

J o e y,

You know, I've never gotten into it far enough to be able to comment on different power amps. I think the speaker cabinets affect the sound more than the power amp, which as you say should be transparent-ish. Bass takes a lot of energy to reproduce so you do need some watts!

I also think the only way to test components is to be able to switch quickly between them and decide what sounds better to you. Our sonic memory is quite short, it's hard to remember a tone, but when you can switch back and forth quickly between components the difference becomes obvious.

The situations I describe above are all traveling light / whatever I can find to play through deals. Powered wedges make me happy, next choice is a direct line to the power amp driving my wedge, next choice is DI to FOH and send me just bass in my wedge (flat, no compression), next is effects return of a bass amp, last is preamp in of a bass amp...

That said, I still use my Walter Woods head with a couple EV 12 cabs around town. But even at the Baked Potato (local club) I run through the PA... Ha!

Jimmy J

(Message edited by jimmyj on December 15, 2011)