The need to screw up...

[wyrtti]

Hi!
 
I have a '91 Europa 5-string which has been the only bass I have used for the past 7 years. I've never bothered to set it up much, since it has been stable and played well. The previous owner also used it pretty much set and forget.
 
Last December I got to try 3 other Alembics. And I was blown away, not just by the tone, but by the action and ease of playing. I had never played any bass with such low action as two of those three had. It was incredible, the strings were so close to the fretboard, yet there was no buzzing, even with my technique.
 
So, armed with this newly found vision about how a bass can be set up, I read up on this forum about setting up the action on an Alembic. Joey's post and lots of others, many excellent threads.
 
And I started tweaking, slowly.
 
By now I have gotten the action down somewhat and the neck is straighter than it used to be. Still things to try, but I am getting there.
 
Except now I ran into a problem.  
 
So far I had only been lowering the bridge, but this time I took it a bit too low and had to raise it. The bass side (B-string) rose nicely, but the treble side (G-string) did not. Only the screw rose on the treble side.
 
I took the bridge apart and tried to oil the screw a bit, and I was able to get the bridge to rise, by pushing at it with a metal tool while twisting the screw up. So, the bass is playable again, but it's a pain to try to tweak anymore, because that one screw and its associated nut aren't playing ball anymore.
 
I believe the problem is caused by the old, unused hardware that has been sweat upon. But I am not sure about this.
 
Any ideas about what to do? I am now obsessed with getting the action even lower.  
 
Should I buy a Bridge Rehab Kit?
 
Thanks,
Topi
 
P.s. I found that setting up the bass and tweaking was a lot of fun, until this point.

[JimmyJ]

Hey Topi,
 
Glad you've discovered how to fine-tune your axe but sorry you've run into this snag.  
 
It sounds like the nut underneath the bridge - which is supposed to rotate with the bolt - is now standing still as you try to raise that side and only the top of that bolt is coming up?
 
It happens...  
 
As I said, this nut and washer which actually suspend the bridge are a special type which are supposed to stay put in their position on the bolt and raise the bridge as you turn the bolt conter-clockwise.  But particularly when the bass is under tension the nut's natural tendency is to stay down with the bridge and not turn with the bolt...
 
I'm sorry to say that if you got any oil on the threads that could make matters worse.
 
Definitely remove all the string tension if you need to raise your bridge, and pull up on the bridge as you turn the bolt so the nut has no reason not to comply.
 
You should wait for better instructions here - but I would guess there is a way to A) remove the oil from the bolt and nut and B) carefully use some thread-lock on the nut.  Bit of a tricky operation because you don't want to get any of that glue between the nut and the bridge...
 
Stay tuned here for more official word on the subject......
 
Jimmy J

[wyrtti]

Thank you for the information and suggestions, JimmyJ!
 
This mosty answers my unwritten question that it is normal to loosen the strings when raising the bridge.
 
I am so stoked with this new low action!
 
And taking the bridge out and really examining it was an adventure in itself. Such an elegant piece of work, the Alembic bridge!

[bigredbass]

If you get the bridge in the position shown in Jimmy's pic, IF you can get the screw out (try the Allen screw with proper pliers or the right wrench holding the nut steady as you withdraw it), to 'sweat-proof' all those threaded bits, use 'Break-Free', a wonder lube sold in gun shops or any sporting goods department that handles firearms accessories.  This stuff will keep those parts going for years.  It's mil-spec, harmless to finishes and electronics, and is just the thing to keep this from happening.  It's THE stuff to keep Floyd wiggle-sticks happy.
 
Typically, steel threads in brass is not usually a recipe for lockup, but introduce random amounts of human residue and other types of wet stuff usually encountered in those places your mama warned you about, they can bind up.
 
I'll take my bridges completely apart every couple of years to do a complete buff on the brass and to re-lube (it doesn't take much) and re-tighten everything, but remember which way it was facing:  I did this the first time and put it back together, reinstalled it, and strung it up, only to find . . . . . I'd put it on backwards !
 
Also if you do that, make a little diagram or take a digital pic of the bridge before you started:  This way, you can put the bridge saddles back in the spots they were in before you started.  Otherwise, you'll have to crank them all the way back into position, and re-synch your saddles to have your harmonics match the fingerboard once again from scratch.
 
Joey

[bigredbass]

As far as adjusting your action, remember, it's not just raising and lowering the bridge.  There is a certain complementary relationship between how flat the fingerboard is (truss rod), the height of the strings over the last fret (bridge height) and at the nut (nut height), and all of this is driven by what feels right to YOU:  The only 'right' answer is what feels best under your hands and your playing style.
 
Generally, the lighter your touch, the lower you can go.  For years early on, I beat the hell out of axes, and played with an action roughly like a rockabilly upright, that's all I could get away with.  I played with heavy picks and routinely broke E's and A's.  Sheeeeesshhhh !
 
Over they years, I learned to calm down, and let those GAIN knobs do their thing, and discovered dynamics.  Then I could have action more like I had in mind.
 
Alembics are the perfect 'lab' to learn this process.  No neck joint to shim.  No fixed nut to grind slots or replace if too low.  The bridge is curved to match the fingerboard radius and adjusts as one piece, no individual saddles.
 
Remember to do your work with the instrument tuned to concert pitch.  The load of the tuned strings can be expressed as a load in pounds of tension (around 200# for most-five-strings).  This has to be constant as you make your adjustments, as you are doing these adjustments against that load.  If you de-tune to raise/lower the bridge or nut, be sure you re-tune as you begin again.
 
And think small adjustments.  You're rarely dealing in more than an 1/8 or 1/4 of a turn on the truss rods or bridge or nut screws.  IF need be, make notes how much of a turn you made on this or that to get back to where you started.
 
And you always make these adjustments with the instrument in playing position in your lap.  Do NOT do this with the bass on its' back with the head propped up:  You'll be introducing some bow that may be too much once you return to playing position.
 
Generally, when you can hear the strings rattling occasionally here and there in the room but not through the speakers, you've got all you're going to get, and every bass' threshold is slightly different.  Unless you're consciously after that sound, if you can hear rattles through the speakers, you've gone a bit too far.
 
Joey

[wyrtti]

Hey BigRedBass and thanks for the tips! I had already read MANY of your posts on the subject.  
 
I've been lightening my touch when playing, it seems when I was younger I was struggling with amps that weren't loud enough and guitarists with stacks. This makes for really bashing the strings.
 
Much nicer now with a nice tube amp, good cab, Alembic and...a lighter touch! The guitarists can keep shredding.
 
I have now gotten my action to just about where I want it. I might be able to get it a tad lower, but for now there is no need. I really love this new ease of playing for the left hand.
 
This forum is a great resource for Alembic users!
 
Thank you!