Alembic Guitars Club
Alembic products => Alembic Basses & Guitars => Topic started by: Mlazarus on August 22, 2022, 05:38:39 PM
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How often has anyone of you been in a situation where you are in a new group and the leader of the group tells you, "I don't like the sound of that bass!" This 1st experience happened to me when I was in a jazz combo of an Army band, stationed in Alabama 1993. I was playing my distillate when the group leader told me this. I thought, there must be a practical explanation of why he confronted me, but damn, he didn't have to be rude about it. If it was a genre thing--you know the Pbass is more appropriate for the type of sound we need to play these old jazz and pop standards, then I would have appreciated it. OR was he just jealous?
Just recently, I had the SAME situation with my Series 1 Bass. The leader of the trio told me the other day "I like your 'special bass' and I know you like playing it but, can you play
your other bass (Pbass) instead? I don't like the sound"
WTF! it's one thing to tell a bass player to change their bass (if they own another one) for recordings. You know, perhaps the producer and writers are looking for a 'specific sound'. like. Take Quincy jones for example; he allowed Louis Johnson to play his 76' pbass one their 1st album. It led to hit songs, but in 76 most bass players were playing the pbass anyway. yet, in 1977 Johnson was allowed to play his --77' Alembic series 1 Omega bass-- on their 2nd album. The sound of that Alembic was the "trademark sound" for the Brother's Johnson hit song "Strawberry letter 23". Then the following year, 1978, Johnson was playing a Musicman stingray on their 3rd album. Hits again. Johnson seemed to have many freedoms to change his sound. ALL the basses had distinct sounds, yet the songs became popular. All for the 1970's R n B, Funk genre.
So, what's the possible deal with this leader I have? I'm annoyed but may comply to his request ONLY because he wrote all the original songs. It's his group after all. I was also using a small cheap amp, so maybe if I use my bigger amp, it may change his mind. Two Alembic experiences in a row. Wow!
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I have never been in a situation where any band leader or members of the band have told me to change my bass. However, when I first started playing bass in Musical Youth I was using my maple Europa bass and the drummer and keys player at the time were telling me that my bass was too twangy. So I invited them to set the tone of the bass rig to what they thought was an appropriate sound. I thought it was too muffled with no note clarity as basically they set a sharp L shape on the amp's graphic Eq cutting off virtually any of the frequencies that you need for a deep but clean articulate sound ( think Astion Familyman Barrett"). So that sound was a starting point for me with my own rig and now I have got just the sound that "I" want the bass to have on gigs which gives them the bottom end they want and me the bottom end and the alembic clarity. Now they love that same bass and and the sound it brings to the band.
So I guess what i'm saying is see if you can find a tonality that works with their music, as we know a lot of bands are after a visual aspect as much as a sound.
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ive gone on stage with just about any neck-through model alembic bass there is. i've been told i was too freaking loud on numerous occasions (what? i can't hear you! i guess i'd better turn up!) but never have i had a complaint about my tone.
i strive to make my playing fit in with the music i'm performing, but my tone is my tone. my playing style is built around that tone. i'm pretty sure i'd be rather offended if someone asked me to change my tone/playing style to suit them. i'm not a slapper/tapper/oompa-pa bassest. sorry. go hire someone else.
i used to have a 2x10 cabinet with a high-frequency horn on it that i disabled because it was too squanky for my taste. a guit@r player once asked me why i turned the horn off and i told him "if you think i'm obnoxious now, you oughta hear me when i scrape my fingernails across roundwound strings at full blast with that thing on". there was no further discussion of the horn.
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Can you play with your tone to see what he's looking for? I can understand this if you need a Nashville PBass sound and you're playing a Jaco bridge pickup tone.... It's not like your Alembic can't change it's tone...
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I've had that happen (in my pre-Alembic days, with a Rickenbacker 4001). The singer/songwriter I was playing with had a specific sound he was stuck on, I heard other possibilities in his music. I thought the 4001 was the right bass for a few songs, but he vetoed it. Those songs just never gave me as much joy after that.
I'd expect a Series I should be able to get just about any sound the band leader wants. Dial in what you think of as a P-bass sound, show them how the controls work and invite them to tweak to taste. Take a picture of the settings (or just memorize them).
It could also be that they're "listening with their eyes" and anything that looks like a Fender P-bass would sound right....
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I have to say, i would be surprised if there is a genre of music that an alembic would not fit into. Yes for some like reggae an alembic is certainly not neccessary when you look at the basic instruments the originals were made on, but i make it work. 👍🏾🎶🎵🔉
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I've never had someone ask me to use a different bass but I have had them ask for a different tone. I do try to set my amp and filters to what most people expect for the style of music. For something like blues or some jazz that means I roll back the filters and treble. It isn't necessarily a sound I prefer but it usually meets expectations of whoever is in charge. As others have suggested I would see if the band leader will work with you on setting the tone he is looking for as he might not even be happy should you use your P bass.
ive gone on stage with just about any neck-through model alembic bass there is. i've been told i was too freaking loud on numerous occasions (what? i can't hear you! i guess i'd better turn up!) but never have i had a complaint about my tone.
I played with a drummer who was always going off on me that I was too loud. I told him it wasn't me so one day I turned my volume all the way down and when he complained I pulled him out from behind his drums and pointed to the volume control. I then suggested he get his hearing checked as what he was hearing was coming from the rhythm guitar. The lower portions of the chords in particular. I don't know if he ever got his hearing checked but he stopped complaining about my volume.
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In the 70's a local producer who was used to a P Bass sound took one look at my BC Rich Mockingbird and told me to set it on the bridge pickup for a recording session. I told him it didn't sound good that way, but he insisted. It sounded like crap and I got fired on the spot. He then brought in someone with a P Bass and cranked out the low budget record. Less than a year later a successful group I was in was getting ready to do a medium budget album and our songwriter told us we would be using the same guy. I refused to work with him. We did a fine recording without him and he missed out on making some actual money.
1) sometimes other people do have the final say. Often they do have a vision of what they actually want.
2) 'doing good business' means doing good business with people.
3) folks should always at least listen to others if they know what they are talking about
4) sometimes 'what goes around' can come back around to bite someone in the butt
On another note, My trusty American P bass Deluxe is the bass I most often record with...
Also, later that year I used my Mockingbird to record on a friend's song (Tad Suckling's 'Molokai Slide') that went on to became a #1 hit in Hawaii, so yes, it was a great sounding bass.
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Soungdog, you hit it on the nose. To memorize or take a picture of the settings. I did just that for a song this band leader wanted. But...he was still stuck on the pbass, Probably, because i started with the pbass for several weeks, then when I finally brought the Alembic, his ears had conflicts with what he was used to hearing. So now I guess he was missing that pbass sound. Understandable. It happened to me in 2012 in an Army reserve band. I was playing my 2008 Fender Jass bass with the Tech21 SansAmp stomp box with chorus and compression. Sounded out of this world! then one day I brought my 95' Ken Smith BT6G bass. We played and he stopped the band and said, "I want the Jazz bass instead". Moral of the story: when a player starts with one type of instrument that has its own tonal characteristic, you may have to stay with it, because the group may get accustomed to that sound. They will want that bass used and nothing else, unless of course you can set the tonal controls to match.
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I have a philosophy in which I believe many bass players can relate to. It's owning specific types of basses that have a distinct sound to match the tonal quality of the genre and OR era of sound from a specific time. For instance: any music from the mid 50's (rock and roll, blues to mid 60s (Motown) to mid 70s were typically and majority influenced Pbasses (with a few exceptions of certain rock bands i.e., Greatful Dead, Fleetwood mac, The Who--All Alembic sounds. So, this is why I like to have the pbass, jazz bass, alembic and Ken smith. The Smith bass (to me) covers a lot of 80's and 90's tunes. My Musicman was perfect for the late 70s to 80s R n B. as well as the Alembic. I like what JazzyVee said about "making the Alembic sound work for the genre". That's what I want to do, since I want my Series 1 to be the Workhorse bass, but I will only use my pbass (WITH flat wounds or Dirty rounds--don't change them Ha Ha) for songs of the 50s, 60s and early to mis 70's (with exceptions of rock tunes starting in 69--YES when Alembic came aboard!). So, maybe I'll cool down and give this band leader a chance. I'll bring my Alembic (which he doesn't like) and make the tonal setting with him. I'll use a bigger amp as well. If he still isn't happy, then I'll resort to the Precision bass. We'll see.
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Many years ago I had a epiphone ebo. The thing sounded like mud. I had a luthier friend install a humbucker in the bridge position and the thing roared after that. I agreed to do a session and I brought my newfound epiphone to it. Some guy comes charging into the studio and tells me the thing sounded like an empty fart. He hands me a hagstrom thing with a neck so bent it was unplayable. End of session. Shortly after I joined a band and they loved that thing. I was playing it thru a fender showman head and one of the padded Knutson bottoms. They told me the bass really made their sound take off. To this day I wish I still had that bass. But I digress. I have been able to dial in almost any tone with my epic. I think that bandleader was a bit envious of the alembic.
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If what i read all the time on talkbass "the sound is in the fingers" was true, the scenario posted by the OP, wouldn't happen. 🤣😂🎵🎶👍🏾
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Pete si, Ha Ha maybe you are right. The band leader may have been jealous. Although he isn't a bass player, he would stare at it with his eyes wide open. Lol. But that may be because he is indirectly saying "Where is the pbass?" I don't know. Damn, I can't have fun with my Series 1!
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Nah, the sound is in your heart and soul!
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And if that don't work, get an Ampeg SVT and blow their butts off!!!
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Ampegs are great amps.
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Everybody has different taste, I guess. We also have to keep in mind; everyone hears frequencies different. I always do very well on hearing booth test. That means I hear most of the pitch's faint sounds. My readings are always 5 and 0 levels. Even in the minus. I used to hear everything at 0! A doctor once said, "You can hear the grass grow!" Some people can't hear high pitches. So, they have musicians compensate for their hearing loss without admitting it. They probably don't even know they have hearing and frequency problems. Those people make lousy Soundboard techs! lol.
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When I was in a band a couple Decades ago.....the band leader kept telling me less Bass....more mid-range & treble! We recorded the album. All the folkies in the band (objected to electric bass) thought it was fine. The leaders mentors (after listening to the master tracks) asked him why he hated the bass player so much? The guy (leader) had some hearing issues and ignored the engineer & producer. I left the group as the leader wasn't open to other opinions.
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I wish I couldn't hear my girlfriends complaining about me... (insert smiley Emoji thingy here) Miazarus it sounds like you have a good attitude.
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Gtrguy, I'm a little wiser with age. Before i would think they are either jealous or hate me. That is always a factor, but a lot of times we are dealing with people's physical and sometimes mental short comings. Then there is the ego and "my way or the highway" type personalities. It's not just the NOTES and Sounds that make a good group, it's the people you surround yourself with. Afterall, Music and performing is one of the ultimate social gatherings. All variables are involved. Find Peace and Happiness!
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OK, I'll jump in too.
I'm one of those guys who believes the sound is 90% in the hands of the player and I've seen many examples of this throughout my career. The aforementioned Louis Johnson reference is a good one. I believe he'd ONLY sound like Louis Johnson on whatever he picked up.
I also say to people who ask me about my basses that they may not be everybody's cup of tea. But they are my entire tea kettle because they're the only basses I own. Almost anybody who calls me these days already knows what kind of noise I make so I'm unlikely to get any flak about the basses I show up with.
I've been lucky to be able to fit my particular racket into a wide variety of music. But there were a couple occasions where I was asked to play something else. And being a hired studio guy in those situations I said "sure, I'll play whatever you've got there". So it was a classic Hofner Beatle bass one time, a Danelectro Longhorn on something else, and several songs on a rented Fender P for another producer. But you know what? In my opinion it all still just sounded like me! ::)
So Michael, I think these bandleaders are just giving you s#it for no good reason. If they're nice about it and you like them then it's up to you how to respond. You might ask if they've also told the drummer to only bring the Paiste cymbals and Ludwig drums? Sounds kinda like a power trip to me, in my opinion.
Jimmy J
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It seems this is a bit unique to bassists. I've heard similar stories numerous times over the years, usually with a non-bassist insisting on a Fender. Yet, as Jimmy alludes to, it is a far rarer occurrence with other instruments. I've never shown up at an audition with a Strat and been asked to play a Les Paul instead.
Bill, tgo
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Threads like these make me realize how lucky I was to play with guys and girls who really appreciated me for who I was and what I brought to the music, and couldn't have cared less what instrument I happened to be playing, or what nuance in tone I happened to be producing at some gig. The point was, I was their bass player. The Anchorman. I was on time, dressed to play, sober, serious, and I held the damn thing together. They could count on it if I was on the job. That was worth something I think.
So I'm trying to figure up how I would balance the ratio between how much static I'd be apt to take from a bandleader about what bass I played versus how much I stood to make on the gig. Hope I never have to, if I ever do get to play again. The money would have to be obscene to leave my choice of bass backstage in favor of someone elses. I prefer to keep my own counsel on those issues. I don't go around telling guitar players what axe to swing, or singers what to gargle before downbeat either. I just do my job, and help them do theirs.
Lemesee Boss... I'm tryin' to see this your way, but I can't seem to get my head that far up my... say, how do know what my bass sounds like witchyo head up in there anyway?!
(save it for the exit interview...)
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This thread has dredged up some past memories I’d forgotten!
The Greek / Balkan band I was in…was there 6 Years! Played music festivals, weddings, radio shows, dance halls in the Seattle area. Now that I think about it….all was fine until the leader & drummer got new wives…who were anti-electric instrument players. I also supplied the PA so the singers (6-8) could be heard over the 12 instruments babbling about. The guys caved to their SO’s and drove all electricity out of the band. With the second band, an electric Celtic affair…..yes, along with electric fiddle AND electric Bagpipes! We were chugging along with music festivals, weddings & recordings everything was chugging along….until a bass player showed up and started dating the guitar player. He was 27 and this was his First girlfriend! Needless to say my days were numbered. She eventually pushed out the fiddle player and drummer….the band collapsed. The guitar player (leader) now is a personal trainer. Being in a band is like being married to 4 or 5 people at once! I have Many brands of basses but Alembic is my voice!
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I was asked that once. I said no. End of conversation. :)
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I read you Jimmy J. In a sense that when you sound like you or Louis Johnson sounds like him, It's the style one has in playing. Jaco's style was fast, clean and tight Pizzicato. He played everything on his Jazz bass with Pbass neck. He played over the bridge pickups. So, he established his sound to complement his style, BUT it was also the sound of the Fender. If he played on a Music man, his style wouldn't change but the Timbre would sound like the Music Man. In my case, I believe this band leader wants only pbass. Because, when i played a solo popping style on the p bass, he said "YEAH!" but then the same song with the Alembic, the sound was significantly different in Timbre, yet i never changed my technique style of playing. I think he just loves the pbass sound. I love it too, but I want time with my best girl-Series 1 LOL.
A few days later, i attempted a compromise; to play the series 1 on the songs that were finger playing only and use the pbass for the two songs he wants for the popping solos. As he really seems to like the sound of the Fender, but he won't admit it. Tell me! I'll adjust and give you what you want. Like a studio musician like you and the others.
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Garyhead,
"I have Many brands of basses, but Alembic is my voice!"............YES, I like that. We all have many brands to suit the occasion and era of music, but I have my favorite overall bass. That's my Alembic.
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A bit more on this... Sorry for these long posts...
I'm the first to admit that my sound palette is limited. I have great respect for those guys who can make a lot of different bass sounds but that's just never been me. I'm a one-trick pony and only know how to slightly vary the tones that I make. For instance, I know nothing about pedals or even amp tones - always just been a DI guy. I never even got into slapping and popping - I left that to the specialists.
And I understand that what I do might not work for everybody in every situation. (Mostly talking about recording as that's the bulk of my experience). Thus my comment about Alembic basses not being everybody's cup of tea. The sound these instruments make is LARGE. I find it very musical, natural, and almost like an acoustic instrument. But it's more like a piano than a "standard" electric bass (to my ear). The sound a Fender bass makes is by comparison small. The entire frequency range of a P-bass might not go as low as the kick drum and might not go as high as the guitars. But some folks want the bass to only sit in that limited frequency range so they can crank it up and it doesn't interfere with any other instruments. I acknowledge this and respect that approach, but then I may not be the right guy for that situation. All good though, to each their own.
That said, since our basses have such a big sound they can be EQ'd to do literally anything. Once I've recorded a part for somebody I'm happy to turn it over to them to work their magic on it and make it fit into their track as they see fit. Sometimes the results might make me shake my head (nasty tone compressed to death... is that still me?) but generally my experience has been good and I've made friends with a lot of great recording engineers.
Now a bit of an aside. Some people are much MUCH more attuned to the sound of particular guitars or basses. I recently got to watch Jackson Browne and his great band play several shows and the guitar trunk on stage right had 13 guitars in it. Those were all for Jackson. On stage left were Greg Leisz's 10 instruments and 12 more for Val McCallum. That's 32 different guitars. Needless to say, the two guitar techs were tuning non-stop! But they wanted very specific instruments for specific songs. As a listener, I gotta say, I don't think I could hear the difference. But it was important for them so ... whatever.
Again, it depends entirely on the situation but I think it's generally not nice to tell a musician they can't play the instrument of their choice...
Michael, I kinda think Jaco, like Louis J, would sound like Jaco on any instrument he picked up. He was known to sit in wherever he showed up and play whatever he could wrench out of the bass player's hands. It really didn't matter, there was no doubt who was playing bass.
My fretless bass is the biggest variation I have to offer sound wise. But I have had bassists I know - who should know better - ask if I was playing fretless on a specific track which I was not. So I guess what seems like a hugely different sound to me ... still just sounds like me.
Jimmy J
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Jimmy, i never recorded in a studio. I fantasized about it when i was 18-19. I know one has to live in locations where recording studios are. Unless you travel. My main recording interest would have been to record in the 70s and 80s when R n B and pop used musicians more. Now the R n B and pop music is all keyboard and electronics, sampling. Simple one chord riffs. Very basic bass lines. It seems Country and Rock maintain the tradition of using Bass players today.
You must currently and have had such a fortunate experience to be a studio musician. I did one gingle in a very small studio once. It was in Germany. I was stationed there in an Army band in the 90s. My friend(German) owned a graphic arts studio in which they would use musicians to record. It was fun. I was allowed to make up my own bassline for a little gingle for, what ever it was for. I dont know, it could have been for a commercial or online or radio. I dont remember. That was the only time i recorded. I, of course recorded with my band. We recorded with our own studio equipment. Then there were times, actually a few years ago, in a reserve Army band, where we recorded a few songs. I did well. I had my sheet music to read, you know you look down at your notes, yet with peripheral vision watch the conductor. So i am trained to play any style under a conducter in a studio setting, but, BUT. i would have realy enjoyed what you do in a civilian studio on a regular bases. I like recording. I used to sit in my room recording on my old Tascam Porta 1 4 track. Lol. As for sound. I typically don't get complaints either, but the knit pickers are out there.
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I haven;'t done a lot of bass studio sessions but i did have a flurry of them for a period during the covid lockdown time and had some issues regarding tone from a couple of producers. The main problem was that they were not used to hearing or working with an alembic bass in the studio so even though i was telling them they could just eq the bass to what they wanted, they were not happy. In the end I just recorded my bass through the rack I use for gigging which was an F-1x and F-2B and they were happy. Sometimes people don't know what they want until they hear something they don't like.
I guess you could always get an alembic with p-style pickups and some flats.
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JazzyVee, no I won't get an Alembic with pbass pickups. Maybe if I record and play in a big group with various music, I'll bring my series 1 and pbass. Set them up and use each for specific styles. I always liked that method. When I was stationed in Germany, one of my commanders/band masters (had 3 different over 6 years) wanted me to play the stick/upright bass, since he was a big band/Glenn Miller type. I was using my 6 string Ken smith as my main bass at the time and already sold my Alembic Distillate (Always regretted that), but didn't mind because I was learning to play the upright. I wonder if Alembic has the stick bass. I know they have the Big classico.
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DR Chill, actually I did set my series 1 to sound very close to Jaco's jazz bass/pb neck. I set the pickup selector to Bridge and set the bottom tone dial arrows to 2 o'clock (if you are looking down), the Q switched are set to 9db. then play on the bridge pickup. Wala! Instant Joco.
And if you are an Isley Brother fan during their 77' to 81' funk days, set the pickup selector to "BOTH", set the Q switches to 9db and turn the tone dials to 3 0'clock. I know the Isley Sound!
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JazzyVee, no I won't get an Alembic with pbass pickups. Maybe if I record and play in a big group with various music, I'll bring my series 1 and pbass. Set them up and use each for specific styles. I always liked that method. When I was stationed in Germany, one of my commanders/band masters (had 3 different over 6 years) wanted me to play the stick/upright bass, since he was a big band/Glenn Miller type. I was using my 6 string Ken smith as my main bass at the time and already sold my Alembic Distillate (Always regretted that), but didn't mind because I was learning to play the upright. I wonder if Alembic has the stick bass. I know they have the Big classico.
I have one of those Classico Basses too, though i wouldn't be so bold as to describe myself as a double bass player yet. :-)
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I have a small thing to chip in.
If people tel you to change bass in a bad way, remember they have no respect for you, bass is just an excuse for them to be an asshole.
There were many situations where guy told me to bring my '66 jazz in studio and I always bring Alembic next to that bass, and usually it's just a jazz bass. and I'm ok with that because I'm just a call guy for certain session, but they asked me nicely " hey I think you 66 jazz would fit perfectly on this track". And al that is ok.
Best thing is when I record at home and send the track to them, that's where I lie :)
A bunch of time they asked is that Jazz bass? I usually when they ask they are not sure, so if it was alembic I say, it a jaz bass.
But, I also love when they say man that bass sounds great, then I brag that it's the Alembic.
It's just so personal thing, so if someone wants you to play jazz bass on their track, that's personal for them too. I'm just honored to be on it with any bass, because I will play it as I play it.
Also on the other side, for me Alembic is a big difference because I play it, but for listeners, sometime they just here it as bass guitar :)
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I have heard many stories of this happening - to bass players. Only a few times to guitar players.
Though I do love the one I heard one of the Wrecking Crew (Leon Russell, I think, but maybe not) tell: He was on a session with Tommy Tedesco, who was in a shoulder-high isolation booth. Producer says that's not the sound he's looking for; could Tommy try a different guitar? TT bends down, sits back up, and plays the part again; no, not it - try another one. TT does it again. After several attempts, the producers says "Yes! That's the sound!" Tommy only brought one guitar that day......
Peter
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We're talking Bass players here.....what happens when the producer / band leader has problems with the piano sound? Wheel in More pianos! ;) ;D ;D ;D ;D :o
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Or just check how Leland is doing it :)
check it at 0:48
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Once again, we REALLY need a "like" button!
Bill, tgo
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cozmik cowboy, Ha Ha, THAT'S A GOOD STORY ABOUT THE GUITAR PLAYER ACTING LIKE HE IS CHANGING HIS GUITAR AND THE PRODUCERS THINK HE HAS MANY IN HIS RECORDING BOOTH. i HAD A SIMILAR EXPERIENCE WITH A 40'S JAZZ MINDED COMMANDER/band MASTER IN THE 90'S. My Army band performed in Debrecen, Hungary. At the downbeat of the 1st song, the Commander looked at me and said< "turn it down!" So, since he always pulled this volume control game with me i decided to turn around and pull the jack out of the amp. Told the Rhythm section "watch this guys!" I turned back around and acted like I was playing. The Jerk Commander/Bandmaster said "Perfec!" with the ok hand sign. This goes to prove these people don't really care or don't listen. It's just control. Some, in your case, don't know the difference in tonal quality, they just have to justify their power tripping by messing with someone.
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I bet if you were using a Pbass with Activators the leader would have thought everything was fine. They’d think you had the best sounding precision ever. And they’d be right.
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I keep all my pbasses with dirty round wounds or flat wounds. They produce that old 60s to early 70s thumpy dull sound that some of us used to here. Listen to the Brady Bunch etudes. The only Fender I keep an ultra-clean sound with is my Jazz bass, where I combine new round wounds, chorus, compression and the Tech 21 Stomp box. I don't really need the Tech 21 for the series 1 though, all though I may experiment.
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I bet if you were using a Pbass with Activators the leader would have thought everything was fine. They’d think you had the best sounding precision ever. And they’d be right.
There are two pro bass players who have tried my Elan with P-style pickups and one said it was really authentic but more variations on the sound and the other one said it sounds nice and he get's what alembic is but for him it wasn't the classic sound. Well i guess it's not designed to be.
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Alembic, musicman, pbass, Rickenbacker. The top 4 basses with a distinct sound.
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Add BC Rich Eagle and Mockingbird from back in the day also!
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How often has anyone of you been in a situation where you are in a new group and the leader of the group tells you, "I don't like the sound of that bass!" This 1st experience happened to me when I was in a jazz combo of an Army band, stationed in Alabama 1993. I was playing my distillate when the group leader told me this. I thought, there must be a practical explanation of why he confronted me, but damn, he didn't have to be rude about it. If it was a genre thing--you know the Pbass is more appropriate for the type of sound we need to play these old jazz and pop standards, then I would have appreciated it. OR was he just jealous?
Just recently, I had the SAME situation with my Series 1 Bass. The leader of the trio told me the other day "I like your 'special bass' and I know you like playing it but, can you play
your other bass (Pbass) instead? I don't like the sound"
WTF! it's one thing to tell a bass player to change their bass (if they own another one) for recordings. You know, perhaps the producer and writers are looking for a 'specific sound'. like. Take Quincy jones for example; he allowed Louis Johnson to play his 76' pbass one their 1st album. It led to hit songs, but in 76 most bass players were playing the pbass anyway. yet, in 1977 Johnson was allowed to play his --77' Alembic series 1 Omega bass-- on their 2nd album. The sound of that Alembic was the "trademark sound" for the Brother's Johnson hit song "Strawberry letter 23". Then the following year, 1978, Johnson was playing a Musicman stingray on their 3rd album. Hits again. Johnson seemed to have many freedoms to change his sound. ALL the basses had distinct sounds, yet the songs became popular. All for the 1970's R n B, Funk genre.
So, what's the possible deal with this leader I have? I'm annoyed but may comply to his request ONLY because he wrote all the original songs. It's his group after all. I was also using a small cheap amp, so maybe if I use my bigger amp, it may change his mind. Two Alembic experiences in a row. Wow!
I've showed up at rehearsals or gigs with my Alembics before and received comments that range from " next time can you bring your jazz bass ?", to comments that were nothing more than veiled insults thrown at me that were the result of jealousy or contempt for having something nice.
Had one guy comment on a gig that my Series 2 was probably " more expensive than the ceiling in this place"...
Another time a friend of the other band members starting ranting at a gig that he knew how much my bass cost, and went on and on...At the end of the night when I was packing up and my Alembic was lying there in the case this guy did a " fake fall " and landed on top my my bass case in what was obviously and attempt to damage my property.
Those aren't the only two examples I have, there are more but those are the two worst ones.
People and musicians can be complete jerks a great deal of the time....
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glocke, Sorry to hear that about the torment and meanness people are throwing at you about you Alembic. Jealousy Truley is a sin.
I never crossed their mind that you worked hard to buy it or was just very lucky. I guess these basses put an effect on some. The guy
in my Jazz combo as i mention before said "I don't like the sound of your bass (80's Distillate). He was mad when he told me. Just tell
me you prefer a pbass tone for the style of music. What's funny, I played a 93' Musicman StingRay afterwards and he said nothing.
Interesting.
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It is interesting to my band leader often recalls telliing people that his bass player only plays alembic basses. There is a certain pride in his voice. He actually wants me to bring my Classico on some gigs.
The name never meant anything to him until we had a dep trombone player with us, after the gig the trombone player came over to have a look at my bass, because he was nodding approvingly all through the gig, and suddenly realised it was an alembic and was enthusing it as he had never seen one before but heard a lot about them in his main band (simply red). The next gig he did with us he took a photo with the bass because his band didn't believe him.
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My Distillate has a vast palette of tone(s). I however have a select few tones that bring me joy (read: feel like a bassist that controls the pocket). Some sound guys are used to Chevy’s and Ford’s and when you drive in with an Alembic they are gobsmacked.
Songdog has a valid point of ‘hearing with their eyes’. Biases based on appearance is a real thing.
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So today i had the rehearsal with the leader who told me to play the pbass instead of my Alembic series 1. I showed up with the series 1. He didnt say anything. I used a larger amp(markbass 15 250w). I maxed the volume and set the gain on the amp to 50%. Then set the pickup selector to bridge and flipped the Q to 9db and tone pot to 3 O" Clock. We started playing in his living room with a wooden floor. The bass sound cut through. Very nice settings. He said he liked it. No more worries. But, i did compromise by telling him i would play the pbass on two tunes where he wanted me to slap. I was happy with agreements. I guess sometines a bass player must play it by ear. Keep a proffesional mind. Bring other basses as options. Negotiate a compromise. Bring the best amp you have. Set the tones and let nature take its course.
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Good for you! We seem to be living in an age of confrontation and the the of negotiation and compromise is getting to be a lost art.
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Also, maybe the leader was worried I would leave the group. He already lost his drummer.
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Or maybe he read this thread. 🤨🤔
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Jayvee, HA HA, no he didn't read this thread. He doesn't own an alembic; he never saw one before until I brought mine. He doesn't even own a computer.
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Haven't heard that one since the 90s, in Nashville country music tours, arenas, concert halls, outdoor festivals.
The crew loved my Series I but the tour managers and artist manager kept asking me to get a Pbass, American Jazz,
so I borrowed one for a tour, but had to give it back when we got home. Sure, the Fender felt good in the pocket for
that two-beat honkey tonk sound, if you will. But I learned how to dial in the Alembic, even my technique by softly muting dynamic
to get very close to that sound.
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Early 80's I was doing a session with Flo and Eddie (Mark Volman, Howard Kaylan, ex-turtles, ex-zappa), walked in with my custom Alembic, and before even plugging it in they said, "as long as it sounds like a Pbass, you can stay otherwise..." They really wanted vintage flatwound fender into a b-15 sounds. We got close, but only because the engineer had a lot of stuff with tubes and jensen transformers to run me through.
I get it, though - nothing sounds like a pbass better than a pbass does.
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I've had my BL complain about my dual Fat Boy equipped Spoiler. Admittedly, at the time I was not fully competent in managing the growl from Big Red. Even now, that particular bass seems to prefer talking 'nasty', and I like it when it does.
But after another acquisition, I've had no complaints on my Series 1 (thanks John-John).
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I get it, though - nothing sounds like a pbass better than a pbass does.
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That's why I always keep a P Bass around. People seem to like what they are familiar with and often a producer or engineer will have an overall sound in their heads for a song before recording. Plus they may have a signal chain all set up (or in their heads) beforehand for one and don't want to take time to change it. And (wait for it) a heck of a lot of great songs have been recorded using one.
I think It would be worth an Alembic owners time mess around and get a good P bass tone on their bass. A foam block under the bridge, flat wounds, tone control settings, palm muting, playing down strokes with a pick, thumb plucking, etc are all fun to try. Or - just get a Peavey T-40 bass!
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I’ll have to dig out the old manuals…..I recall seeing the “settings” on the SF2 to mimic a P-bass…..or was it a J Bass?
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I think It would be worth an Alembic owners time mess around and get a good P bass tone on their bass. A foam block under the bridge, flat wounds, tone control settings, palm muting, playing down strokes with a pick, thumb plucking, etc are all fun to try. Or - just get a Peavey T-40 bass!
This tone description sounds an awful lot like what I get with my upright. ;-)
I did freak worship leader out once when I showed up with my upright. He literally asked me, "Did you bring a real bass, too?" BTW the service went great with the upright.
C-Ya................wayne
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Sounds a good resolution. Maybe when he gets used to the alembic sound he may be more relaxed about you bringing whatever bass you choose. Well done. 👍🏾🎶🎵
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It's all about the others getting use to the bass sound. The bass sound tends to define the character of the environment. Example: a dance club I used to go to in Germany back in the late 90's had a house band. I would walk into the club and hear my friend Patrick playing his Bass. I don't remember what type it was, but it had this nice warm, heavy growl to it. The sound was always present to the point that it became a type of ambient or white noise, you know what I mean? I mean, his bass was the sound, character and personality of the environment and I swear, if the bass tone ever changed, I don't think I would "Feel at home" in the place anymore. Like "Hey, something is wrong here, what's changed" Sound in general define an environment's personality. It really does. So....with that said. You, me and you others on this forum can understand that if you start with one type of bass and tonal quality, the others with get used to it. Then when YOU decide to change basses, which can alter/change the environment, you will get feedback from others. Sometimes negative. Well, they got used to the original sound. My situation has changed with my band leader recently. Although he wanted me to play the pbass instead of the Alembic series 1, I continued to play it anyways. Not defying him, but I wanted him to get accustomed to the newer sound. He did! BUT he still wants me to play the pbass on some of his songs. That ok with me. It's being a professional.