Alembic Guitars Club
Alembic products => Owning an Alembic => Troubleshooting => Topic started by: hammer on June 07, 2020, 09:23:57 AM
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I’ve got two five pin cables for my series basses. They both appear to be original so are quite old. One is now crackling but the connections at both ends all seem good and I’ve isolated the problem to mid cable where it appears a one point something extremely heavy was dropped or sitting on the cable flattening it.
Given the age of my cables I’m really concerned only having one and no backup. At some point back someone posted about a connection that made extremely high quality five pin cables but I’ve been unable to track the posting down. Does anyone have a recollection as to who was making these?
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Bayou Cables. I had him make me a purple 5-pin several years ago. Great cable and I never mistake it for any other cable!
Bill, tgo
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I have a couple of Bayou stereo-to-mono cables and they are good quality. I think Edwin mentioned another cable maker he has used, but I can’t find the thread with the name. Alembic sells new five pin cables as well, I have a couple of the newer Alembic cables and as would be expected they are very high quality :)
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I remember the thread you're talking about but can't find it either! (with custom cables)
For what it's worth, I use a Bayou cable too - you can choose different colors! I rarely play my Series bass unfortunately so can't really comment on longevity, but it seems like a fine cable, and actually I've used Bill TGO's cables too and had no problems.
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These guys will make pretty much anything, using whichever brand of cables and connectors you like. https://www.redco.com/Custom-Cable.html (https://www.redco.com/Custom-Cable.html)
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I've been using these cables which are made by an Alembic Series owner and they are very high quality and heavy duty. He's really into making cables for Alembic owners.
https://rayraydecker.com (https://rayraydecker.com)
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I went with the RayRaydecker cable and it’s all Edwin indicated it would be. Very high quality.
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While I never needed a Series cable (!drat!) I've bought cables from Butch at Bayou and cannot recommend him highly enough. First class guy, I've gone to using his Canare/Neutrik cables with the L-shaped silent quarter inch and love them.
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I went with the RayRaydecker cable and it’s all Edwin indicated it would be. Very high quality.
These are actually the only cables I've used other than ones I've built myself in the last 25 years or so.
I highly recommend that everyone learn to solder properly. It's incredibly liberating and empowering. My cable failures over the last few decades have been few and far between. It's not crazy hard to do and is more intimidating than it should be. At the very least, that way you can repair cables if they do break down.
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I highly recommend that everyone learn to solder properly. It's incredibly liberating and empowering. My cable failures over the last few decades have been few and far between. It's not crazy hard to do and is more intimidating than it should be. At the very least, that way you can repair cables if they do break down.
Any recommendations for becoming a better solderer?
I do it so infrequently that there are ALWAYS gobs a plenty when I am complete... kinda embarrassing but it is the truth. :-[
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I'd bet there are many youtube vids on soldering that would be useful - I haven't looked, but I should. I'm self-taught but can offer a couple tips from my own experiences.
#1. The solder is only meant to secure the two pieces physically together and not as an electrical path itself so make sure the contact points are solid before you encase them in lead.
#2. The goal is to heat the pieces you are soldering hot enough so that THEY melt the solder. If you can get the solder to at least start melting without directly touching the tip of the iron with it then it will flow over the two parts you are trying to connect and make a solid bind.
#3. When working with our 5-pin connectors I always mount an opposite connector in my vice and use that to hold the one I'm soldering. Because if you heat the pins (especially on the male connector) a bit too hot they can melt the nylon (or whatever it is) that they're mounted in and shift out of position. Having the connector you are soldering plugged into its opposite counterpart will keep the pins aligned even if it gets a little too hot. (Um, that may be an indication of my own poor skills so take this with a grain of salt.)
#4. Get a good "solder sucker" to help if things get out of hand. HA!
Jimmy J
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Thanks Jimmy.
#2 is some solid advice that sounds fundamental... I just need to remember it next time I need to venture into that realm.
WWW research scares me these days, there is so much information that it turns into a daunting task off sifting through what makes sense and what is none sense.
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WWW research scares me these days, there is so much information that it turns into a daunting task off sifting through what makes sense and what is none sense.
I’ve learned a lot of my working on guitars skills from youtube. When I want to check out how to do something, I try to watch several different videos. For instance, I was given a Champ amp with issues. I’ve soldered lots of guitar electricals and feel at least competent with an iron. And I’ve recently began building my own on-board preamps. But, other than building a Heathkit guitar amp when I was 13, I haven’t messed around much with amp electronics. There are restoration kits for this amp, so I thought I might try doing it myself. Anyway, I watched several youtube videos on how to discharge capacitors. I found about 4 or 5 that all seemed to basically agree. But there was also one or two that had it different or suggested shortcuts that didn’t seem to jive with the others. If I had seen this one first and stopped there .........
Videos are an excellent tool, but you still have to get “second opinions” and do your homework.
The only suggestion I might add to Jimmy’s list is to get some alligator clips or other type of clips to use as heat sinks if you are soldering something other than wire to jack, like resisters, caps, etc. I know Mica has posted how to wire a cord to sum the stereo signals of an older Series instrument into a mono signal that includes a resister at the plug. And I LOVE Jimmy’s idea of using the mated end of the jack as a mounting device. Brilliant! Why didn’t I think of that?
Bill, tgo
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I highly recommend that everyone learn to solder properly. It's incredibly liberating and empowering. My cable failures over the last few decades have been few and far between. It's not crazy hard to do and is more intimidating than it should be. At the very least, that way you can repair cables if they do break down.
Any recommendations for becoming a better solderer?
I do it so infrequently that there are ALWAYS gobs a plenty when I am complete... kinda embarrassing but it is the truth. :-[
The reason that people end up with gobs of solder is generally that they are (like I did when I was learning) putting the wires together and then heating while applying solder. This is a very problematic way to solder, as you get too much solder and generally people are more concerned with getting the solder on the wires than ensuring a good joint between the wires. The best way to do it is to first tin the surfaces of each wire (or jack contact), which means heat it up and flow a bit of solder on them. Then put the surfaces together and heat them and make sure the existing solder flows between them and creates a good joint. It takes a little practice, but the result is a stronger connection without too much solder. The only reason not to do this is when you need to solder multiple wires to one connection (such as when I just wired up my 1/4" jack for my Starfire with Series electronics. Just loop the wires through, and then heat and add solder, being careful not to use too much). It's actually surprising how little solder you need for a good joint.
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👍🏽
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I purchased a very useful "third hand" type vice which has a couple of alligator clips on ball joints, and a magnifying glass to boot for $10 on Amazon which made soldering my own 5 pin cables a snap. And yes a solder sucker or wick is handy for desoldering!
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Speaking as a guy who makes his living soldering, having a good iron is crucial. I've heard that this one is decent www.parts-express.com/stahl-tools-stssvt-variable-temperature-soldering-iron-station--374-100 although I use a Hakko 888 myself. Also keeping your tip clean with one of these (don't use a wet sponge, it shortens tip life) www.parts-express.com/soldering-iron-tip-cleaner--370-369 . Beyond that, it's practice practice.
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I like the tips and tricks. Thanks guys!
hdfixer - funny thing, my neighbor moved to Las Vegas a little over a year ago and purged a bunch of stuff from his basement, and of course I was happy to take his "stuff". I am pretty darn sure I have one of those 'third hand' thingies from him! :-D
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Soldering is pretty easy, but soldering *well* can be hard!
As has been mentioned, if you want to get good solder joints, you need to quickly heat the wire/lug to a temperature which will cause the solder to liquefy and flow into the joint, something on the order of 400F. The soldering iron tip is much hotter than that, so the solder will liquefy quickly when it touches the tip, but if the pieces being connected are not heated to a temp where the solder will be liquid, it won't flow into the joint and make a solid connection. That's when you get lumpy connections. If the things being solder are way too cold, then the liquid solder will crystallize when it hits the joint, which makes a dull-colored cold solder joint. These are really bad because they have higher resistance than a correct solder joint. That won't matter much at the low voltage of your guitar's electronics, but if you make a joint like that in the hot connections of a solid state power amplifier, the extra resistance will cause those joints to heat up.
You have to make the connection hot, then let solder flow in, and hold it completely still until the solder has cooled, otherwise you'll again get a cold solder joint.
Solder used to be 40% lead, but lead is frowned on these days because of toxicity, so the solder you buy today is a usually a different mixture which requires more heat and is a little harder to solder with. You can get a better connection with silver solder, which requires even higher temps to work with.
Guitar parts are somewhat harder to solder than a PC board. Getting a connection on the back of a pot means heating up a very big piece of metal compared to a tiny PC trace on a board. Soldering 1/4" connectors are particularly hard because there's a lot of metal again (and there will be physical stress on the ends later). Fortunately, the 5-pin XLR connector used by Series basses are pretty easy as you're only heating that little solder pot connection.
Since this is the Alembic board, I shouldn't get called down for saying that the equipment that you use makes a huge difference. You can solder guitar electronics with a 35w solder pen for $20, but it's hard to quickly build up the heat you need. A temperature controller soldering iron costs a lot more, but can put a lot of heat into a joint to make a good connection and uses special tips so you can dial in the temp you want. I use a really old Weller WTC which was an old standard for electronics.
Your "hygiene" techniques make a huge difference too. Electronic solder has a rosin core. When you heat the solder, the rosin liquefies and flows over the joint which cleans off oxidation in preparation for the solder (this is what's making the smoke too). You can buy soldering flux which is like a paste, wipe it on something like a 1/4" connector and it will really help make a clean and effective join. Also, the hot tip of the soldering iron gets covered with oxides as well, which don't conduct heat very well. So you really want to clean the tip of external oxides, then touch a tiny bit of solder to coat the tip right before you make the connection. This is the purpose of a sponge or the little ball of golden tinsel that you use to clean the soldering iron tip before use. Easy and inexpensive to use and makes a big difference.
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Thanks David.
:)
Succinct!
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If anyone has been thinking about ordering one of Ray Raydecker's five-pin cables he is currently having a sale. 20% off on everything until tomorrow night... (Monday 11/30).
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Another vote for https://rayraydecker.com He is a wonderfully positive guy who owns a beautiful Flame Walnut Series 1 . I'm getting a 5 pin in colors to match my Series 2 6 in production, a 16 ft lead in red for the studio and a 25ft lead to match the 5 pin. His choice of colors and connectors is truly impressive.
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For some reason I really dig unusual colored cables. I have a purple 5-pin for my Alembic that I got several years ago from Bayou Cables based on a recommendation from this forum.
I see from you FTC thread, Danno, that your getting black with red stripe cables! Most excellent! Looking forward to watching your new one progress. I assume it will, of course, be black?
Bill, tgo
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Why Yes, it will be black. Basically a Medium scale Phil Lesh 6 Omega (not heart) with black hardware, my DT cross inlay from my Kay bass and a 2nd custom I had done, (cross is red) Red rays on the Inlay logo and some slight red accents on the crest inlay. Red leds of course. It will go well with the Moody black and red straps I have. I've never even played a series 1 or 2 so I imagine I'm in for a real experience. I'm pushing 60 now so it was about time. So even the cables will match! Should be arriving soon from Raydecker. I'm a very lucky guy. Thank God I didn't have to pass this by any senior management!