Alembic Guitars Club
Alembic products => Alembic Basses & Guitars => Topic started by: Deltaphoenix on April 23, 2019, 11:50:52 AM
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Hey Everyone,
I wanted to ask a few questions before moving forward with purchasing a Series 1 bass. I am very familiar with using filters for sound/tine design; I have had a bass with the ACG/East filter preamp and I use modular synthesizers quite a bit too. The modulars are what is driving some of my interest in Alembic, I love the idea of 2 different sounds coming out of the same bass and then using the modular for further sound design/sculpting. I thought about looking at some other less expensive options like getting a Ric or even a Yamaha attitude but I am really drawn to Alembic. There is also a Northern California and Grateful Dead connection with the brand of modular synthesizers that I use - Buchla. So, it seems to make sense.
I would really love a used Series 2 but I just can't pay 5 figures for a bass right now (I wonder if I am going to get Alembic fever and make it happen anyways...). So, I have been looking at used Series 1 basses and in particular, longscale ones. In general, it seems like I can find a late 70s Series 1 from $4500-$6000. I have also seen this lovely 2001 Series 1 for a little under $9k:
https://www.chicagomusicexchange.com/listing/alembic-series-i-burled-maple-2001-s565/21803832
What are the main differences between earlier and more recent Alembic basses? Ergonomics? Electronics? Weight?
What questions should I be asking sellers of the older Series 1 basses beyond basics around upkeep and so on? It seem slike there has been some sort of electronics change that can be back ported.
Any other words of advice? Can I find a Series 2 for $9k? I am really leaning towards that one from 2001 with the Burled Maple top, is that priced too high for what it is?
Thanks!
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Did you get that one? It shows sold. It’s a beauty.
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Not yet. They put it on a 24 hour hold while I get the funds to put it on layaway.
I would still love to here the pros/cons of older Alembic basses compared to newer ones.
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Well, they all sound different regardless of year due to wood combinations, string choices, and electronics settings, etc. That said, they all sound distinctly Alembic.
I’ve played Series I Basses from each year 1974 to 1980, as well as a 2015 Series II. The 2015 was more hifi sounding than the older basses, that was the biggest difference I noticed. The 1974 bass had a very unique and beautiful sound, what I hear in my mind as quintessential Alembic, but that’s just my preference. So as I hear them, newer ones are more hifi and older ones have a more classic tone, but they all sound like Alembics.
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Some older Series doesn't need the electronics upgrade?
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From what I understand, some do especially if you are in an urban area with lots of interference, but some apparently do fine without it. Others will have more detail on that.
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Here’s the link to the FAQ on the “Upgrade” with more info:
http://club.alembic.com/index.php?topic=268.0
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It is a lovely bass for sure however the wonderful thing with Alembic is that you can have them make exactly what you want. This is especially important in the neck department. Good luck with whatever you decide.
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You can easily acquire Late 70s to early 80s Series I in the price range you specified (or a Series II for the price you indicated for that matter). I own several Series I basses and other than a few additions to the electronics and a few more stringers to the standard neck, they pretty much sound the same to me. If you invest in a SF-2 Superfilter you'll be able to get just about any tone you want out of your instrument and from the prices I've seen, the purchase of an SF-2 will cost considerably less than moving from a Series I to II.
Keep in mind that as others have indicated with an older bass an electronics upgrade might be needed. I'd check with Mica on current pricing but depending on what they need to do that could set you back $750 to well over $1,000. So...make sure you either get an older bass at a price that results in the upgrade making sense or move to a 1990s bass. Somewhere else here can confirm when the change occurred that led to quieter instruments.
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Oh cool, so adding an SF-2 to the signal chain of the Series 1 does in fact provide some of the Series 2 flexibility. Nice. Is the SF-2 literally the same elctronics or is there a difference in say how far the LPF will close say 40hz vs 80hz?
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Oh cool, so adding an SF-2 to the signal chain of the Series 1 does in fact provide some of the Series 2 flexibility. Nice. Is the SF-2 literally the same elctronics or is there a difference in say how far the LPF will close say 40hz vs 80hz?
The SF-2 filters can be set from 45Hz to 6.0KHz, Series LPF is 350Hz to 6KHz. But... the SF-2 can be set to low-pass, band-pass, or high-pass filter all with adjustable gain and damping factor making it quite a bit more versatile than the electronics in a Series II.
There isn't a huge difference between the Series I and Series II electronics. Series II adds a master volume and variable Q which can be swept from 0— +15dB. The Series one Q-switches are preset for 0/6/9dB of gain. If you get a Series I bass and really want to upgrade the electronics it isn't prohibitively expensive to add the master volume and CVQ. I have one of each, the variable Q is nice but not a deal breaker. I find the master volume to be useful and had one installed in my Series I.
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Thanks for the details, Stephen.
Well, it is official, I put 20% down on that bass and will own it by the end of the month! Super excited to join the club!
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Thanks for the details, Stephen.
Well, it is official, I put 20% down on that bass and will own it by the end of the month! Super excited to join the club!
Welcome to the camp!
I think you will be very happy.
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I just realized that my bass doesn’t have the stereo/mono switch and I actually have a use for it. Not the end of the world but a little bit of a bummer.
Does that possibly mean this basses 1/4” out is stereo? I think I also read that some Series just don’t have it.
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This bass likely has the 1/4" jack wired in mono. You will have stereo output through the 5-pin and power supply still. You can always rewire the 1/4" jack to stereo or even add a stereo/mono switch later yourself.
Basses before 1990 or so will likely have a dedicated stereo output, after that, more likely a dedicated mono output. But remember when buying used that the bass was likely special ordered, so anything in fact goes :)
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Awesome, thanks for the clarity, Mica.
I would bet it is mono being from 2001 but like you said, who knows :)
Hoping it has all of its documentation when it shows up.
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I never ran my Series basses from the batteries. In fact, my 78 Series I didn't have that option and neither does my Series II equipped Starfire. It's pretty easy to carry around a blue box power supply.
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Oh yeah, congrats, you're going to love it!
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That is quite likely, I have a 1980 series I bass and that has a stereo jack socket so using a 1/4" lead you only get the neck pickup. Fortunately for me I always use the 5pin cable but there was a stereo to mono cable that came with the bass so I can use that if needs must.
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I have no issue with using the Blue Box but the use that I would have for the switch is this:
When I am processing the bass through the modular (or even heavily through pedals) I have 2 different signal chains. Flipping the switch from Mono to Stereo would give the ability to add the second chain in an impactful way. For example, when in mono the sound is more normal, flip the switch For stereo and the second signal is going through fuzz and a pitch shifter so there is a lead sound on top of the original sound.
FYI I do also just play more normal bass but I do like to whacky too
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You will definitely want to use the blue box not batteries due to their short lifespan in a Series bass.
Looks like the bass you bought comes with the "old' style blue box. The newer version has a mono/stereo switch. Using either box in stereo means you can add a second signal chain but it will only be fed by one pickup. You still wouldn't have a switchable second signal chain but could always fudge it by running one pickup though a signal chain with no effects, one pickup with effects and using the pickup selector to get either pickup/signal chain or both. With the newer box set to mono you could also have two mono outputs each going to a different signal chain and instead of a switch use a volume pedal for the feed to the effects.
It is possible to use both the blue box and the 1/4" jack simultaneously but the bass will run on batteries only in this configuration so it isn't very practical and you would still need a switch or pedal somewhere to turn the second signal chain on/off.
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Yeah, it looks like I will need to consider ways to route and what I am processing the signal with.
My Buchla 200e modular has preset recall and can accept Midi CC messages. I have a Moog MP-201 and I think it can send CC messages so it looks like I can (after I figure it out ;)) have a footswitchable way to enable an output to be heard from the stero out, reroute what/how the sound is being processed and so on because I have a matrix mixer in the Buchla. This should be fun!
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Great catch, thats a lovely bass. I have a series II and it has a mono jack but i always use the external power supply. I have just created a lightweight rack with sf-2, ds-5 and 1u class d power amp. It works great but you can find yourself chasing your tail trying to find the right tone. At the moment im setting it in low pass mode to get control of the frequencies below 350hz and band pass on the other channel to emphasise the low end punch. For serious bottom end accept no substitute. 😁🎵✔️
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The 1/4" jack on most of the Series basses built before the late 80's is wired in stereo. It's easy to convert to mono - ask Mica and she will send you the schematic that shows how to do so.
Look here for more: http://club.alembic.com/index.php?topic=270.0
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But remember when buying used that the bass was likely special ordered, so anything in fact goes :)
I entered this wonderfully supportive community when looking for the history of my Epic. Once you have the serial number, post it in the Serial Number discussion under Owning an Alembic. You can learn much about the bass. I do also suggest you register the bass with Alembic.
Congrats!
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Mick, yes sir. I am definitely going to register my bass with Alembic and I will post the serial number in th eserial number discussion.
I had some great momemtum selling things to get this 1/2 way paid off. I feel like I have hit a wall the past couple of days. I am sure that I will get some more things sold soon and bring this bass home.
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GREAT NEWS, I have paid the balance on the bass and i expect that I will have it here by Friday! I am so excited!
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AWESOME!
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Pretty sure if there is no s/m switch the 1/4" out is mono. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.
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Congrats on getting this bass, I just missed out on this very instrument when it was advertised last year. The serial number request did get answered in the request section BTW, but it had been sold by then!!! Can't win them all, so they say, ended up with another series 1, which is great.
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Cool, Jonnio. I just looked and found the thread. Wild, the bass was initial delivered to S. Korea.
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TODAY WAS THE DAY!!!
What a lovely instrument: it plays well/smoothly, it sounds so nice and clear, the sustain is out of this world, the electronics/filters are fun and useful. Very happy about the purchase and I am excited to keep exploring this bass!
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Congratulations! Very nice bass. Welcome to Alembic-land.
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Congratulations Dustin!
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Congratulations & Compliments on a beautiful bass, and a slightly belated Welcome to the Club here. :)
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Thank you all so much! So glad to have taken this leap and to have found this particular bass:
1. The width and shape of the neck really works for me and is fast. I can tell that I can’t be lazy with my hand positioning - I am 6’2”, can deal with a long reach, have fairly long fingers and have a habit of keeping my left thumb anchored and leaning my hand to do more stretching, thus fretting more with the side of my finger. Also need to revisit how hard I fret. I wasn’t getting an insane amount of finger noise but I am inspired to work on changing some lazy habits.
2. The clarity of the pickups makes me excited to really work on listening more to how my right hand impacts the tone. Of course I understand what moving towards the bridge or neck does, playing hard with my fingers or using my fingernail or thumb and so on to play does - it just does more and this an opportunity to focus on subtle changes in a bass line.
3. The sustain...just WOW. When I plugged into my modular and made a patch where one output was basically going through a tremolo (looping envelope modulating a low pass gate) and the other output was run through a bandpass filter that was being modulated an LFO that was controlled by a sequencer, it was sublime. The notes would ring out, the tremolo was providing a steady rhythm and on top of that the bandpass filter was doing interesting things on top. Super Fun.
4. This bass is sexy! It is very rare for me to look at a burl top and really like it. I have seen a few interesting/cool ones but I never thought it would be my thing. This top is gorgeous, the depth of the burl is interesting and striking. The body shape is so different from any bass that I have owned and is even cooler in person. It feels Gibson-ish but so refined compared to anything they have done.
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;D
Sounds like you are on the right path AND that you realized that a finely crafted (sexy) musical instrument will expose your (our/ mine) lazy habits.
Enjoy, it only get better.
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Yay!
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Well done and please feedback your gig experiences with it.
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Thank you all so much! So glad to have taken this leap and to have found this particular bass:
1. The width and shape of the neck really works for me and is fast. I can tell that I can’t be lazy with my hand positioning - I am 6’2”, can deal with a long reach, have fairly long fingers and have a habit of keeping my left thumb anchored and leaning my hand to do more stretching, thus fretting more with the side of my finger. Also need to revisit how hard I fret. I wasn’t getting an insane amount of finger noise but I am inspired to work on changing some lazy habits.
2. The clarity of the pickups makes me excited to really work on listening more to how my right hand impacts the tone. Of course I understand what moving towards the bridge or neck does, playing hard with my fingers or using my fingernail or thumb and so on to play does - it just does more and this an opportunity to focus on subtle changes in a bass line.
3. The sustain...just WOW. When I plugged into my modular and made a patch where one output was basically going through a tremolo (looping envelope modulating a low pass gate) and the other output was run through a bandpass filter that was being modulated an LFO that was controlled by a sequencer, it was sublime. The notes would ring out, the tremolo was providing a steady rhythm and on top of that the bandpass filter was doing interesting things on top. Super Fun.
4. This bass is sexy! It is very rare for me to look at a burl top and really like it. I have seen a few interesting/cool ones but I never thought it would be my thing. This top is gorgeous, the depth of the burl is interesting and striking. The body shape is so different from any bass that I have owned and is even cooler in person. It feels Gibson-ish but so refined compared to anything they have done.
Oh yes, that is Alembic, indeed. One more seized...
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It's almost like wearing glasses for the first time and finding out that everything you've know for your entire life is way more detailed and has more depth. The Alembic Experience.
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EX-cellent analogy!!!
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It's almost like wearing glasses for the first time and finding out that everything you've know for your entire life is way more detailed and has more depth. The Alembic Experience.
That may be the most accurate descriptive post I've read yet. If I had another 20 tries, I couldn't have said it better. Well put, Mario. ;)
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I agree, awesome analogy Mario. I could totally related because I have actually started wearing glasses within the past year!
@Jazzyvee - My next gig is a solo one, more electronic music focused but there is probably room to sneak it in somewhere. I had the beginnings of a nice, new 2 man group last year and then my wife decided to give birth :P The little guy is a little over 8 months old and my wife suggested that I pick that project back up. My buddy is an excellent drummer, we both used electronic instruments: synths, modular synths, iPad apps, lush fx pedals and built loops, and then played over them. There is 100% room for bass in this project. Now we just need to stat jamming/practicing again! My buddy and zi talked this week and next weekend will work since it is Mother’s Day today. Stay tuned!
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;D
Sounds like you are on the right path AND that you realized that a finely crafted (sexy) musical instrument will expose your (our/ mine) lazy habits.
Enjoy, it only get better.
My Epic 4 has taught me how to play my other bass better. Alembics are truly amazing instruments.
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So, just a tiny update on this Alembic journey.
I recently acquired an Elektron Analog Heat mk2 to run this Series 1 through (I need to name this bass!). The AH is a stereo gain\distortion box as well as filter box with 7 filter types I think. It also has an LFO, envelope follower, 2 external cv modulation inputs and a modulation matrix with a lot of targets PLUS recall for presets I make. https://www.elektron.se/products/analog-heat-mkii/
I have experience with Elektron gear so the UI makes sense. I was able to get some fun sounds quickly: setting a threshold on the env follower so that I have touch sensitive control over the gain meaning when I played harder, the more gain on the sound. Then running that through the filter with LFO controlling cutoff. It was easy to get fun but compelling sounds that are expressive.
This type of sonic exploration is definitely an example of the silly stuff I have planned for this bass ;D
I guess what remains to be seen is how many tricks this box has up it’s sleeve and if it is enough to justify it’s space in my music area. Doesn’t only work with the bass though so hoping for lots of utility from this little FSU box.