Alembic Guitars Club
Alembic products => Alembic Basses & Guitars => Topic started by: Stanley Road on June 04, 2018, 12:53:49 AM
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Hi, I'm afraid that I'm new to this place and know practically nothing about Alembic basses. I have circa 50 guitars including 6 basses. Albeit I am British, I am located in the Middle East, so seeing an Alembic bass is as rare as hens teeth, however, one has come up for sale and I have a few photos. I am hoping to get the serial number later today. The bass itself looks like it needs some TLC and a good clean. It appears to be an EPIC 5 but I'm a little curious to it's veracity as the neck wood doesn't look like a laminated neck and I thought that this model was a multi piece neck. I'm hopefully going to look at the guitar later today.
Anyone got any views on this model and whether it is real......what the wood is?
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It's an EPIC model. I have the same model with quilt maple top wood. Yours looks like zebrawood. these were the entry level instrument for Alembic so the wood quality isn't perhaps as vivid as that used on more expensive models but they're still better than most other maker's top of the range models.
graeme
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Hmm that is an interesting bass.... that certainly isn't a standard looking neck construction to me and the fact it seems to be non laminated and with a join leads me to wonder if if could it possibly be an early prototype or test bass or maybe a replacement neck or headstock. It certainly needs to be verified before parting with money.
Alembic are critical with detail so even small things like the logo and the brand name not being centralised on the headstock gives me concern.
Do you have any chance to check out the bass in person?
Certainly ask the seller for some pictures of the control cavity and the truss rod cavity to see if the electronics are standard and it has a dual truss rod neck.
Some other things to note.
Also note there is a serial number stamped on the back of the headstock on this picture of an epic bass, something I don't see on your photograph.
(https://images.talkbass.com/attachments/dsc00044-jpg.2362309/)
Here is a clearer view of a typical Epic neck construction which again seems different in your pictures.
(https://images.talkbass.com/attachments/dsc00045-jpg.2362310/)
Also note the position of the alembic name tag appears under the D string tuner not above as in your picture.
(https://s14-eu5.startpage.com/cgi-bin/serveimage?url=http:%2F%2Falembic.com%2Fclub%2Fmessages%2F395%2F108671.jpg&sp=346300340e34aa3225cc4aff46e886ca)
Others with more keener eyes and knowledge of the Epic model may offer a different or supportive analysis of what your pictures show.
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Alembic are critical with detail so even small things like the logo and the brand name not being centralised on the headstock gives me concern.
Yes, yes and yes. That jumped out at me before I even saw Jazzyvee’s response. I would think even an ‘after hours’ build/prototype would have keener attention to detail...
Do as suggested and request better photos of the details mentioned in Jazzyvee’s post.
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The neck and logo look very wrong to me.
Backside of headstock photos - the tuners don't look right.
The logo looks sloppy and second rate. Like a knock off.
Also notice a lack of veneer between the core and the top of the body.
The knobs also look a little off. Possibly a touch bigger than they should be.
Looks like a knock off to me and I would steer clear of it.
I think your gut is telling you that this is a knock off and I believe you should trust your gut. That is why you posted this here, right?
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I am 99% sure that is a knock off.
Another thing I notice is the truss cover. It doesn't look right. The color is a bit off. Could be the photographs but all things taken into consideration it just doesn't seem right.
The body looks a little longer and more narrow that an Epic should.
Another thing...
On the back of the body there is a section wood grain (or something) that is going perpendicular to the rest of the grain.
That is not up to par for Alembic. Highly doubt they would use a piece of wood like that.
The more I look at these photos, the more I see that does not look right.
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You can see a scarf joint on the main portion of the neck which an original Alembic neck wouldn't have on a neck with a volute. The typical body wood for this model would be mahogany but I can't tell from the picture if this one is. It doesn't have the color or grain pattern I would expect but that could be the lighting. As you said it does look to be in rough shape. If the body is original, I suspect it is, then at the minimum the neck has been heavily repaired or replaced.
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Somebody somewhere in southeast Asia had some Epic-shaped bodies on ebay a while back. I bet this is one. Hard to say about the hardware and electronic components from those pictures... they look legit, just amateurishly mounted.
My gut says this is not 100%. Maybe not even 1%.
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You may find the serial number is under the backplate on the shelf that it
screws into. The official release year for the Epic is 1994, though there are
a few '93s out there. The bass looks like it has been played. If it is a knockoff,
and I am not totally convinced, is it possible the neck has been replaced? That
would be a skill beyond me. On my Epic 4 the tuners for the A and D strings are
almost touching each other. The cone headstock has had a few adjustments
done to it over the years, as has the body.
Hopefully Mica will check in with her opinion.
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The truss rod cover and back covers are usually plastic unless it was a custom option when ordered.
I don't want to put my neck on the block and say it's fake but I think with so many things that look non standard it's worth making sure you are getting the full blooded genuine item.
The other thing that looks wry to me is that the pickups look different widths, that could be an optical illusion but hopefully the OP will relay any info back to us here.
Or as you say lembic 76450 mica may enlighten us.
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I don't want to put my neck on the block and say it's fake...
I will! It's fake.
Too many things look wrong and/or questionable about it. First off, the neck. But the body also has issues.
I don't mind putting my neck on the block and saying that it is fake. If I am wrong, then so be it.
As my wife can tell you, I am wrong pretty often. LOL!
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Thanks for the responses, I have subsequently been sent this photo of the back of the headstock and serial number.
The serial number looks about right but the headstock and tuners look dubious!
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Its a 1996 model and the serial number sequence looks in line with the 1994 number from J-V's update. However the stamp font looks a bit off to me. There have been times that Alembic couldn't get the customer tuners with the "A" so that it in itself isn't conclusive. Mica will have the definitive answer. If you want a genuine Alembic I would pass on this one as even if the body and parts of the neck are original the neck has had a major repair which to me devalues it considerably. To quote an missing member, "There will always be another".
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It's not legit.
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As my wife can tell you, I am wrong pretty often. LOL!
Isn't that sweet of her not letting you forget such an important nugget? ;D
Edit: Fix formatting
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Hi, Stanley,
Along with many others, I, too, have questions regarding the bass's constitution/construction/authenticity and its sale. Regardless, good luck with the inspection, and welcome!
-Zut
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This serial number, am I reading it right as 96w9881, is reported as stolen on the
main Alembic page.
It is also listed as a 5 string Zebrawood Epic.
It may be the real deal, altered headstock to disguise it?
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This serial number, am I reading it right as 96w9881, is reported as stolen on the
The main Alembic page.
That's what I read as well. Good catch.
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This serial number, am I reading it right as 96w9881, is reported as stolen on the
main Alembic page.
It is also listed as a 5 string Zebrawood Epic.
It may be the real deal, altered headstock to disguise it?
Wow, where was it stolen from? Can the owner be contacted?
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... Can the owner be contacted?
I've left a note for Mica; she maintains the list.
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... Can the owner be contacted?
I've left a note for Mica; she maintains the list.
Great, thanks, if it is that guitar it would be great to try and assist the owner in getting it back. Hopefully, those photos will assist him or her identify it.
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I have emailed the person that reported this serial number stolen, so I hope to hear from them soon, but I have serious doubts that this is that bass, or if it is, it has been HEAVILY modded. There are a lot of things here that are suspect.
Here's some stuff that I notice:
1. headstock repair - as Keith noted, there's a scarf joint way down on the neck. Now, we have done this a couple of times for customers, so this alone isn't an issue.
2. Can we talk about how wonky the bridge looks? Those barrels on the bridge are not correct, and neither are the fasteners for the intonation screws. If it's intonated correctly, it doesn't look like the bridge is in the correct place.
3. As Jon, noted, the logo is wrong. All wrong. It looks like someone made a copy of a logo. gross!
4. The pickups don't look right either, and they don't look to quite match to my eye, but the bridge pickup isn't quite as big as an AXY either.
5. Jon also noted the knobs are wrong. People do change these all the time, so by themselves it isn't really a flag, but with everything else, it matters.
6. The backplate is not original, and it's the wrong shape. Maybe to a casual observer the finish and shape wouldn't be weird, but to me and most of you here I'm sure you can see it. Along with the screws, it doesn't add up - though of course people lose screws and replace them all the time, but again, combined with all the other matters, it's a big deal.
7. The neck wood was originally 5-piece Maple. So not only was this replaced with a single slab of wood, it was repaired.
8. The serial number stamp is not from our set of stamps.
9. The body woods do not look quite right to me, but the pictures are small enough that I can't really confirm about the quality of the wood.
10. The peghead itself isn't symmetrical.
Please share picture of what's inside the electronics cavity if you get a photo of that. This is a mysterious bass indeed. Where is it located now?
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I have emailed the person that reported this serial number stolen, so I hope to hear from them soon, but I have serious doubts that this is that bass, or if it is, it has been HEAVILY modded. There are a lot of things here that are suspect.
Here's some stuff that I notice:
1. headstock repair - as Keith noted, there's a scarf joint way down on the neck. Now, we have done this a couple of times for customers, so this alone isn't an issue.
2. Can we talk about how wonky the bridge looks? Those barrels on the bridge are not correct, and neither are the fasteners for the intonation screws. If it's intonated correctly, it doesn't look like the bridge is in the correct place.
3. As Jon, noted, the logo is wrong. All wrong. It looks like someone made a copy of a logo. gross!
4. The pickups don't look right either, and they don't look to quite match to my eye, but the bridge pickup isn't quite as big as an AXY either.
5. Jon also noted the knobs are wrong. People do change these all the time, so by themselves it isn't really a flag, but with everything else, it matters.
6. The backplate is not original, and it's the wrong shape. Maybe to a casual observer the finish and shape wouldn't be weird, but to me and most of you here I'm sure you can see it. Along with the screws, it doesn't add up - though of course people lose screws and replace them all the time, but again, combined with all the other matters, it's a big deal.
7. The neck wood was originally 5-piece Maple. So not only was this replaced with a single slab of wood, it was repaired.
8. The serial number stand is not from our set of stamps.
9. The body woods do look not quite right to me, but the pictures are small enough that I can't really confirm about the quality of the wood.
10. The peghead itself isn't symmetrical.
Please share picture of what's inside the electronics cavity if you get a photo of that. This is a mysterious bass indeed. Where is it located now?
Thanks for the rundown, that is a fairly comprehensive list! The bass is for sale on a website called olx.com.kw which is located in Kuwait. I usually do a bit of research before buying second hand guitars.
They had it priced very cheaply which should be another indicator. As I said I don’t know much about Alembic basses so appreciate the input.
If you hear from the person that had their bass stolen it would be great to hear their response to photos...... it makes you wonder whether the bass was stolen and then used for substandard fakes to be copied from.
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How much was it listed for?
Not sure what the currently is there where it is for sale but can you do the conversion to dollars?
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I couldn't find the listing on that website, search term "alembic" returned no results.
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How much was it listed for?
Not sure what the currently is there where it is for sale but can you do the conversion to dollars?
The currency is Kuwait Dinar, they have it listed with another guitar for a total of 160Kd, he sent me a text message stating that he wants 120Kd for the bass with a hard case which is about USD$400!
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I couldn't find the listing on that website, search term "alembic" returned no results.
It isn’t listed as Alembic!
https://olx.com.kw/en/i2/ad/bass-guitar-and-rhethm-guitar-ID6Nvgf.html#:d3b152add3
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$400?!
Well then... There is absolutely zero question in my mind that the bass is fake. From all the info here and given what Mica just said, I am going to bet that this is a total knockoff.
I agree with you that the stolen bass could have been used as the basis for the fake(s) to be made.
I would also bet that if you were to see it in person, it would be even more apparent that it is a knock off.
Personally, I don't think that this is the stolen bass but most certainly there is probably some relationship.
If the price seems to good to be true, it almost always is.
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It isn’t listed as Alembic!
https://olx.com.kw/en/i2/ad/bass-guitar-and-rhethm-guitar-ID6Nvgf.html#:d3b152add3
LOL!
You should have mentioned that up front.
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It isn’t listed as Alembic!
https://olx.com.kw/en/i2/ad/bass-guitar-and-rhethm-guitar-ID6Nvgf.html#:d3b152add3
LOL!
You should have mentioned that up front.
You often see random things listed here with unusual spelling or missing the brands off completely. That is usually due to the person not being an English speaker. I have bought some quality guitars (Fender and Gibson) here that have been brought in by expats who often sell on leaving.
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Knew I remembered this thread Jazzy posted from somewhere: http://club.alembic.com/index.php?topic=22982.msg230638#msg230638
...may have absolutely nothing to do with the subject at hand here, but Mica confirms it was not made by her folks. Now we have this mystery Epic-shaped thing. Hmm. ::)
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Knew I remembered this thread Jazzy posted from somewhere: http://club.alembic.com/index.php?topic=22982.msg230638#msg230638
...may have absolutely nothing to do with the subject at hand here, but Mica confirms it was not made by her folks. Now we have this mystery Epic-shaped thing. Hmm. ::)
Ahh, we appear to have a workshop in Sri Lanka knocking out fake Alembic bass guitars.
There are quite a number of Sri Lankan videos of guys playing Alembic basses. Perhaps you experts should comment on each one!
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Yes, agreed, the bass in the first video if fake, as it says "made in Sri Lanka"
It sounds terrible too.
However, the Epic basses in the other 3 videos appear to be completely legit.
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Just spotted this one on you tube.