Alembic Guitars Club
Alembic products => Alembic Basses & Guitars => Topic started by: gridchin on March 31, 2018, 02:04:18 PM
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Hi guys! I’m a bass player, play mostly metal music and I’m thinking on getting a 5 strings Alembic. I’m looking for an aggressive sound. I love the Orion shape, so I’m considering buying one Signature Standard. I’d would like to hear your advices and experiences with Alembic in metal music, specially with the Signature model. My current concerns are the weight (the Signature Alembics that I saw for sale are over 12 lbs) and the ergonomics (I move quite a lot on stage).
Any advices and recommendations are very welcome. Many thanks in advance guys!
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Welcome to the Alembic Club. :)
Just the guy you need to talk with is around here somewhere... in the meantime, here's their www presence:
http://nij.damagedjustice.nl/
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I believe besides FC there are a couple other Metal guys here.
Regardless of genre, Alembic basses have such tonal flexibility and clarity that you really can't go wrong. Add to that the artisan craftsmanship put into each one and they are beautiful to look at.
If that wasn't enough we can discuss the integrity of their design which makes them brilliantly easy to play - they almost play themselves.
P.S. A wider strap can help with distributing the weight of the instrument.
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Whatever electronics package you get, I'm thinking Exploiter! Something like this but in black? (This was sold over a year ago, can't find the black 5-string that was discussed on the club a couple of years ago)
https://reverb.com/item/1733376-alembic-exploiter-custom-cocobolo-5-string-bass (https://reverb.com/item/1733376-alembic-exploiter-custom-cocobolo-5-string-bass)
(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/867/39340354050_439d161484_z.jpg)
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Check out his sound on his band’s youtube channel.
https://m.youtube.com/user/DamagedJusticeNLD/videos?shelf_id=1&sort=dd&view=0
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(http://fcbass.nl/alembicmetalbass.jpg)
;D
Welcome here! :D
Orion would be a great choice because of the weight and ergonomics requirements, but I would advice to get one (or mod one, it's pretty easy) with a Filter setup.
Bass and treble setup is great, but I find it much more useful in a " subtle" situation. Same for a multiple Filter setup, for raw metal a single Filter is more than adequate.
My Series I is undergoing surgery so I'm using my Elan 5 in my " subtle" band now, in that setting I can hear the difference in pickup selection and Filter/Q settings much better.
In the Metal setting that distinction mostly gets lost in the hard driven tube amp and wall of guitar sound, so I would say the Signature setup is also more useful in a subtle situation.
Though if you have enough budget, there's no reason to not go for it. ;D
They can do aggressive very well, depending on what you use for effects/amps. In this clip I use an extremely saturated Ampeg model from Line6:
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Hard to go wrong with an Alembic. They can all cut like a knife. I don't play metal, but I do play a heavier form of progressive rock (Rush, Crimson) and I'm very happy with my Distillate for a lot of our material. As far as body style, based on what you're saying, I'm thinking Essence. Very compact, almost Spector-like.
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I am selling my Distillate Exploiter in case you are interested.
Would definitely recommend it for metal!
http://club.alembic.com/index.php?topic=23575.0 (http://club.alembic.com/index.php?topic=23575.0)
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Hey guys! Thank you very much for your comments! I really appreciate them. I think I’m more then ready to buy my first Alembic :)
FC, your JPJ pickup configuration is gorgeous! Very nice video :) A Filter setup is definitely a plus.
The Exploiter model looks really cool, unfortunately it’s difficult to find them in 5 strings version. Essence model is elegant as well. I like its compact body. This one with Buckeye Burl top is really amazing https://reverb.com/item/1814456-alembic-custom-essence-5-string-buckeye-burl Though this one is quite expensive.
I think I’ll give a try to a Signature Standard with an Orion shape. There are several used ones for sale on the internet, still have to decide which one. And have to buy an extra wide strap for it :)
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Wanted to second the recommendation for you to get a bass with a filter or add one. I don't play in any metal bands but do play with enough guitarists that use heavy distortion from time to time and having the ability to quickly move the resonant peak of the bass pickups via the filter and engage the Q-switch can really help cut through a distorted guitar. If you can find an Orion body that was made neck-through instead of with a set neck you will get even more punch. The Essence is a great small body Alembic and would weigh less than an Orion. Some members here have added a filter to their Essence and Wolf also added the brass block under the bridge. His Essence has a great punch to it. So many good choices only limited by how much you want to spend or if you are buying used what is currently available.
Good luck with the search!
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I sold an epic 4 bass to a bass player here in the UK who is in a heavy metal band. He works in a large music shop and has told me it's his number one bass now.
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5 string will give the lowest lows.
Maybe jwright can offer feedback on the Distillate/ Exploiter, not sure of its scale length - on my standard Distillate I have a hipshot d-tuner mostly set to D but right now it holds a C rather well... a tad on the floppy side but a lighter touch allows it to "boom" rather nicely.
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Just ordered this Mark King V Buckeye Burl Standard! Can't wait to play it!!
(https://images.reverb.com/image/upload/s--JoJ_-37Y--/a_exif,c_limit,e_unsharp_mask:80,f_auto,fl_progressive,g_south,h_1600,q_80,w_1600/v1520746496/mqx2san67ikrmtpzayxy.jpg)
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Nice choice.
Delicious!!!
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Cool. My favorite Alembic body shape. It is going to be heavy but the Balance K style does a great job of distributing the weight. Having two filters is a plus, too. Enjoy!
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Absolutely beautiful! Congrats, by the way. I've never seen a bass with those 2 strap pins, though, on the tail.
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Nice Bass... Congratulations & Compliments. 8)
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Thank you guys! I really appreciate your comments :)
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Awesome entry into the Alembic world! One thing we forgot to mention: They're kinda addictive... ;D
With that neck recipe You're in serious sustain territory, fierce competition for sustaining/feedbacking guitars at the end of the songs. You're gonna love it :D
Also, watch out for anything that is above you (and can move) when hitting those low notes. 8)
Congrats, you did well!
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Congratulations, man you gonna live it!
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Wow what a bass. I think it's great that you are bringing an alembic into that genre like FC Bass as i've read so many times on the UK Basschat of bass players being told their bass does not fit in with the image of the band, and selling it to get something that "fits".
Both you and FC Bass are indeed qualified to be Alembic's Metal Bass Ambassadors. :-)
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Be aware that the filter demands some peculiar way to get your tone and you have to get yourself some time to get used to (way different from Fender's all knobs up - bad - habit). Folks on this club are very helpfull and we'll all be glad to help you on this brighter and happier new bass life phase, ha. Welcome!
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Oh well pointed out Mario, I recal my stressful times with my first alembic as it is a two filter bass as well. I developed a method that helped me enormously to get the hang of what is going on and it will be really interesting to hear how you get on with this bass. Especially after your first gig.
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Sad news guys.. After buying the Alembic I posted its pic here and growlypants mentioned about the different position of the strap pins (thank you for noticing it). I inspected the photos closely and found that indeed one of the pin position has been changed, also another pin was added. And there was a covered hole in the body from the previous pin. This modifications were not mentioned in the description of the post, and the bass was announced as mint. In case of a cheep bass I won't care too much, but in this case it was too expensive for me to not care. So I decided to cancel the deal. I don’t blame the instrument neither its seller. He received this Alembic as part of a deal from another person, and he didn’t know about this modifications.
I feel very sad about this situation, but I won’t feel good after paying so much and having an instrument with this background. My search for Alembic continues. And lesson learned, have to be more careful in the future.
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Sorry to hear that it didn't work out BUT good eye spotting the mod.
I agree with your decision.
I am selling Mark King Custom 5 that may be of interest to you.
Check it out.
https://reverb.com/item/10957001-alembic-mark-king-signature-deluxe-balance-custom-5-string-bass-2000-flame-maple-led-s
(https://reverb.com/item/10957001-alembic-mark-king-signature-deluxe-balance-custom-5-string-bass-2000-flame-maple-led-s)
This one truly is mint. Looks brand new.
I will make you killer deal if you are interested.
Let me know.
Thanks
Jon
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You may also want to consider this one.
https://reverb.com/item/10317508-alembic-mark-king-deluxe-5-string-2015 (https://reverb.com/item/10317508-alembic-mark-king-deluxe-5-string-2015)
The seller is a member of the club here and would probably hook you up.
I can personally attest to the amazingness of this particular model/configuration as I owned one nearly identical but a few years older.
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You may also want to consider this one.
https://reverb.com/item/10317508-alembic-mark-king-deluxe-5-string-2015 (https://reverb.com/item/10317508-alembic-mark-king-deluxe-5-string-2015)
The seller is a member of the club here and would probably hook you up.
I can personally attest to the amazingness of this particular model/configuration as I owned one nearly identical but a few years older.
Thanks for your comments guys!
I really like the Omega shape. The only thing that scares me from this particular bass is its weight (12.14 LBS).
jwright9, why did you sold yours? Just curious, cheers! :)
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How much did the one weigh that you were about to buy?
It must have been at least 11lbs I would imagine.
If 12lbs is too much, then you definitely don't want the one I am selling.
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How much did the one weigh that you were about to buy?
It must have been at least 11lbs I would imagine.
If 12lbs is too much, then you definitely don't want the one I am selling.
The seller says it weights 10.7 lbs. But you are right, these basses are on the heavy side.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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My favourite is an Alembic. Any style, any package. Turn it up. Regardless of model, it will do your bidding. Or you, its bidding, more likely.
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Hey guys! I’d like to share with you some exciting news :) I bought an Alembic Mark King V Signature Deluxe Cocobolo! It’s one of finest basses I ever played. The attention to the details and the woods are amazing, literally it’s a piece of art. Soundwise it’s gorgeous, love its huge deep tone. Also love its sound possibilities, much better then the typical bass, middle, treble config.
The only cons is the weight. I think it’s the heaviest bass I ever had :) Planing to buy a wide strap and remove the 4 batteries that are in charge of the leds to make this bass lighter.
Now I have to learn how to master the filters + switches :) Thank you guys for all the support!
(http://gridchin.com/basses/alembic/IMG_20180411_162909.jpg)
(http://gridchin.com/basses/alembic/IMG_20180411_163131.jpg)
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Wow, that bass got to you very quickly!
I personally don't think taking out 4 batteries will make much of a difference weight wise and you will compromise not having LEDs for a very small weight difference. But hey, you are the one holding and playing it.
Glad you like it. Awesome bass.
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Oooh, that's nice!!
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Excellent! Congrats!
Quickie startup advice for the pickups/filters - it's probably a good idea to experiment with one pickup by itself first - get comfortable with how the filter works. I find that the Q switch set to 0 is a great sound - the Q boost has a very distinctive character. On my Alembicized P-Bass, I use the neck pickup with the filter set towards the middle, not too low to make it muffled - then dial in a tiny bit of bridge pickup to widen the sound. But your needs are probably very different than mine. Have fun!!!
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So you went straight in at the deep end, huh. Way to go!
Weight-wise, you might look into replacing those brass backplates with a set of plastic ones - best check with Mica, but I'd hazard a guess they could make you a set with shielding paint and all. Hm, they could probably do wooden covers in a nice contrasting or complementary species and grain.
The 6 string in my profile weighs in at like 12.5 lbs, but it's all worth it. ;D
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Beautiful bass! Would love to have the same one.
I tried essentially the exact same bass in the showroom in Santa Rosa. When I picked it up it was heavier than I expected but once I put my Moody 4" strap on it felt very comfortable with nice even distribution of the weight. The Moody straps are made of extremely pliable Italian leather and feel amazing right out of the box, no need to wait for the leather to break in. Alembic used to sell Moody straps with the Alembic logo on them.
Agree that you are going to lose more than you gain by removing the batteries for the LEDs. My first thought was the same as Adriaan's, change the brass back plates. That will save you a lot more weight than removing batteries will.
One other thing to note about the Q-switch. It primarily is going to alter the attack at the frequency you have selected with the filter, the basic tone of the pickup is going to come from the filter setting. I find the Q-switch very helpful for cutting through distorted guitars. The combo of the filters and Q-switch is almost like having an arsenal of different basses/pickups to select from, all in one instrument. Takes some getting used to but well worth the effort.
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The plastic or wood backplates are twice as thick as the brass ones, 1/8" vs 1/16", so they will protrude from the back and look, well, not good! Because the plates are handmade, it might be better to try and make them locally. Using a 1/16" plastic would be okay, and as Adriaan notes they must be shielded on the inside surface. That's pretty thin plastic, but if you are careful, you can save a lot of weight that way, and you can keep the original brass plates safely tucked away.
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Very nice, congrats!
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Thank you very much for your kind words and advices guys!!
Indeed, the brass backplates are very heavy. I will ask a local luthier for a plastic or wood 1/16" ones, shielded on the inside surface. I tried removing the 4 batteries, and you guys were right - there was no noticeable difference in the weight. So I placed them back. I think the ideal solution would be luminlay side dots (http://www.luminlay.com/featuresen.html) - thinking about a future build :)
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If your future build is for a Series bass the LEDs wouldn't need batteries they would be powered by the DS-5 as would the bass. You could take out the batteries that power the electronics as long as you didn't want to use the 1/4" jack. Since the battery life is short in an instrument with Series electronics the external power supply is the way to go.
Post some pictures of the new back plates once you get them made and installed.
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Sorry for my ignorance, what are the differences/advantages of series electronics compared to MKII? Thank you in advance.
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Others here may be able to provide you with a more nuanced perspective on the differences but here is mine.
The two single coil PUs and hum cancelling PU allow for an even greater degree of flexibility in ones tonal palette than the Signature electronics. Series PUs allow for stereo or independent amplification so one can, if desired and with the proper amplification run each PU through a separate channel and cabinet. It's like having an SF-2 built in to ones bass. With the Series II one gets the flexibility of a continuously variable bass and treble filter, a master volume as well as separate volumes for each PU.
The CVQs for bass and treble on the Series II provide the capacity for a much finer range of filter adjustments than the two or three position switches available in other Alembic basses. More filter when you want and less when that's needed. The drawback is these that basses tend to be a bit heavier than what you already own. The alternative, which results in less weight on your shoulder, is to buy a Superfilter 2 (SF-2) which provides just about everything but the stereo capacity of a Series bass. I've got both Series I and Signature basses and with the SF-2 I can basically duplicate any tone I can get from my Series bass with my Signature running through the SF-2. The only difference is that the SF-2 is sitting in my rack as opposed to hanging off my shoulder.
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Others here may be able to provide you with a more nuanced perspective on the differences but here is mine.
The two single coil PUs and hum cancelling PU allow for an even greater degree of flexibility in ones tonal palette than the Signature electronics. Series PUs allow for stereo or independent amplification so one can, if desired and with the proper amplification run each PU through a separate channel and cabinet. It's like having an SF-2 built in to ones bass. With the Series II one gets the flexibility of a continuously variable bass and treble filter, a master volume as well as separate volumes for each PU.
The CVQs for bass and treble on the Series II provide the capacity for a much finer range of filter adjustments than the two or three position switches available in other Alembic basses. More filter when you want and less when that's needed. The drawback is these that basses tend to be a bit heavier than what you already own. The alternative, which results in less weight on your shoulder, is to buy a Superfilter 2 (SF-2) which provides just about everything but the stereo capacity of a Series bass. I've got both Series I and Signature basses and with the SF-2 I can basically duplicate any tone I can get from my Series bass with my Signature running through the SF-2. The only difference is that the SF-2 is sitting in my rack as opposed to hanging off my shoulder.
Thank you for the detailed answer hammer! I think I still have lots of possibilities to explore with the Signature electronics, but definitely will take a look into the SF-2.
Already ordered an extra wide strap and spoke with a local luthier about the possibility of creating lightweight backplates. Will share photos once I’ll have them :)
Have a great weekend guys!
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Gridchin, that's a fine-loooking MK Sig. Congratulations! As far as the weight goes, get the widest strap you can find (at least 3") and you will get used to it. Part of the reason Alembics sound as massive as they do is the weight. So think of it as a good thing!
I have both Series I basses with the 3 position q switch and Series IIs with the QVC. I actually prefer the 3 position switch over the QVC for live work, as it's easier to find a tone on the fly. As others have said, the best way to get a handle on what the filters do is one pickup at a time. Roll the balance so that only one pickup is working. Leave the Q switch down. Play around with the the filter knob, going from one wide open (bright) to closed (very bassy). Then, do the same thing with the Q switch up. Then, roll the balance to shut that pickup off and repeat with the other. Then, repeat the process -pickup by pickup with both pickups on. You will get the hang of it fast.
By the way, the main difference between the Series basses and the MK Sigs (or any other Alembic) is the pickups. The Series basses use a wide aperture single coil pickup which are made hum-cancelling by the use of a dummy coil that sits between the 2 pickups (which is why some people think Series basses have 3 pickups). Your MK Sig (and all Alembics except for the Series basses) uses humbucking pickups. The pickups on your Sig are called AXYs. There are 2 different AXY pickups- the "regular" ones and the Fatboys. The Fatboys are wound to have a bit more bottom end to them. I have a MK Sig that began its life with 2 regular AXYs. I swapped them out for 2 Fatboys, but honestly it was too much... the bass wasn't punch enough for me that way. Now, I have a Fatboy in the bridge position and an AXY in the neck and it's perfect. But I also loved the bass with 2 regular AXYs, too.
Your MK Sig is an amazing bass and with a big amp at stage volume and new strings it WILL kick major ass.
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Thank you S_wood!! I think you are right. Lightweight basses sounds fine, but not as massive as Alembics.
I really like the concept behind the filter knobs. So different from most other basses, where I usually have the tone wide open.
I’m curious about Fatboys pickups. Couldn’t find any comparisons on youtube. Some day I might get these pickups to try them out.
Already thinking on the next Alembic, non-stop GAS! :)
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I really like the concept behind the filter knobs. So different from most other basses, where I usually have the tone wide open.
Welcome to the warm, wet world of filter-driven tone circuitry... there ain't nothin' else like it. ;D
Regarding the FatBoy; there are a bunch of threads in this section with commentary and comparison. Just search that term (and variations of it) and you'll find them. One thing is for sure, they're not for every one of us... 'jazzyvee' tried them in his Stanley Clarke Sig. and found he preferred the standard AXY's. Our buddy 'bigredbass' liked them so well that he put them in both positions of his Big Red Spoiler.
My firsthand experience is limited to my own Custom, which has a FatBoy in the bridge position and an AXY in the neck. Compared to my other two Alembics with AXY's only, the bridge pickup can do so much more on its own, especially for fretless glissando work. If you're somebody who occasionally solos out the bridge pickup, then I highly recommend you try one. If you tend to strive for keeping a good balance, I probably wouldn't bother. There's no modification required to install one... just unplug one and plug in the other, so you could feasibly try it, and sell whichever pickup you don't prefer.
Happy Hunting. ;)
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In the Metal Genre there are at times alternate tunings causing slacking of the strings . If string tension is an issue for you then I would would suggest staying in the long scale selection of an instrument . Any Alembic bass would work for you and long scale for that genre might be a good choice in my opinion.
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Indeed, long scale seems to be the way to go. One shop here in Europe have a second-hand Alembic Stanley Clarke Deluxe 5 for sale. I was interested, buy few people made me change my mind by telling me that its 30” scale wont handle the low B quite well, specially if drop tuned to A which I do frequently.
I have a serious GAS for an Alembic 5 with Buckeye Burl top. Found one brand new Essence 5 with this top, but a bit pricy though…
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I don't play metal and don't use any effects in my bass rig but a simplistic idea if you really wanted that short scale is get with an octaver set to give a note an octave below the played note so you wouldn't have to detune. Forgive me if that is just plain crazy.